6-spd man vs. CVT: Best AWD, best mpg?

[subiesailor]

Originally Posted by EMK

my husband believes that the engine will last longer with the cvt because it doesn't spin around as fast as it would with a regular transmission.

EMK I have yet to find someone who actually wears out any of the engines built since the 90's. Given the car - the various systems around the engine all tend to fail long before the engine its self ever comes close to being worn out. RPM's with engines these days don't really matter unless of course the oil is terrible and not maintained but thats a whole different argument.

[fatabbot]

Originally Posted by subiesailor

EMK I have yet to find someone who actually wears out any of the engines built since the 90's. Given the car - the various systems around the engine all tend to fail long before the engine its self ever comes close to being worn out. RPM's with engines these days don't really matter unless of course the oil is terrible and not maintained but thats a whole different argument.

Very true, but a CVT theoretically would keep the engine in the "sweet spot" with no lugging or over-revving which would both shorten engine life. As you said, though, I doubt there's any real practical longevity gain in modern engines. With cars today, the rest of the vehicle will become cost prohibitive to maintain before the actual engine (in most cases).

[bcnu53]

my wife bought me a 2010 with 6 mt 2.5
it was a nice car but I did not care for the color inside or out and the 6 mt was a pain in the rear I thought. it might work better with the larger engine but for me I was always shifting to get in the power band.
I decided I did not like the color enough and so traded for a 2011 different color inside and out. also got the cvt trans and WOW oh WOW
this is a total different car than the 2010 was. I really am VERY happy with the cvt.
I don't check mileage very often but it seems to me the 5 mt got better mileage than the cvt does but since it is more fun to drive and performs much better I would do the cvt all over again
for the most part I have always wanted a MT car, but the 6 speed in the outback did not impress me at all. the one I had before it was a 5 speed mt and it drove much better than the 6 speed did.

[subiesailor]

Originally Posted by bcnu53

my wife bought me a 2010 with 6 mt 2.5
it was a nice car but I did not care for the color inside or out and the 6 mt was a pain in the rear I thought. it might work better with the larger engine but for me I was always shifting to get in the power band.
I decided I did not like the color enough and so traded for a 2011 different color inside and out. also got the cvt trans and WOW oh WOW
this is a total different car than the 2010 was. I really am VERY happy with the cvt.
I don't check mileage very often but it seems to me the 5 mt got better mileage than the cvt does but since it is more fun to drive and performs much better I would do the cvt all over again
for the most part I have always wanted a MT car, but the 6 speed in the outback did not impress me at all. the one I had before it was a 5 speed mt and it drove much better than the 6 speed did.

Same here my previous subaru was the 5sp mt and it was far far superior to the new 6spd MT. The gearing is far too tall and the 2.5 just does not have the power for it making for a really poor driving experience all the way around. The CVT has a far better range of gearing add the torque converter and the fact it does a fantastic job keeping the engine in the happy zone its by far the best thing Subaru ever did for the 2.5 engine.

I really liked my old 5spd MT lots of fun to drive - it handled the San Francisco hills great even with our boat! The 6spd MT I test drove two different cars because I thought something was drastically wrong with the first one LOL.

[EMK]

All I know is that its got something to do with how far the things inside the engine go up and down .

[EMK]

Oops, make that -sideways-.

[MetroWestMA]

So I had an old 5 speed limited that I bought in 2001 and retired in 2006 via Craigslist with well over 100K -- great car and totally reliable.

Because, like everyone else I use cell phones and am busy, I cannot see why anyone would choose a 6 speed manual transmission when the CVT performs better and get's better gas mileage. You can also use the paddle shifters to downshift and upshift at will.

MW

[fatabbot]

Originally Posted by MetroWestMA

Because, like everyone else I use cell phones and am busy, I cannot see why anyone would choose a 6 speed manual transmission when the CVT performs better and get's better gas mileage. You can also use the paddle shifters to downshift and upshift at will.

Define "performs" better? I've seen nothing to indicate that at all. As far as gas mileage, most of us that have experience with the 6MT can easily match the figures reported by CVT owners, especially around town.

My preference is based on driving enjoyment, nothing more. Even the best automatic saps the fun out of driving, especially in a vehicle that's a bore to begin with.

[sosubeme]

Full disclosure: I haven't driven either of these.
When selecting a vehicle I consider the total cost of ownership over it's lifetime. It's not my habit to turn a car over every 5 or 6 years, I attempt to get the max return on investment through length of ownership rather than equity from sale or trade.
That being said, calculating routine maintenance and consumables costs are fairly straightforward, it's the unforeseen catastrophic repair expenses that often shape the owner's perception of vehicle value and reliability.
I often select the established technology over the new one until servicing the new technology is more commonplace and less expensive. This choice also permits working the kinks and quirks out of newer systems by the manufacturer over a period of time. Some exceptions I was quick to embrace were fuel injection, electronic ignition, and disc brakes (yeah... I've been around awhile) figuring the upside was huge and downside minimal.
I don't feel the same concerning CVT, surely it has advantages over existing options, just not comfortable with expense of maintenance and possible major repairs over the long term. I'd take the stick.
Just my .02, Cheers!

[subiesailor]

Originally Posted by sosubeme

Full disclosure: I haven't driven either of these.
When selecting a vehicle I consider the total cost of ownership over it's lifetime. It's not my habit to turn a car over every 5 or 6 years, I attempt to get the max return on investment through length of ownership rather than equity from sale or trade.
That being said, calculating routine maintenance and consumables costs are fairly straightforward, it's the unforeseen catastrophic repair expenses that often shape the owner's perception of vehicle value and reliability.
I often select the established technology over the new one until servicing the new technology is more commonplace and less expensive. This choice also permits working the kinks and quirks out of newer systems by the manufacturer over a period of time. Some exceptions I was quick to embrace were fuel injection, electronic ignition, and disc brakes (yeah... I've been around awhile) figuring the upside was huge and downside minimal.
I don't feel the same concerning CVT, surely it has advantages over existing options, just not comfortable with expense of maintenance and possible major repairs over the long term. I'd take the stick.
Just my .02, Cheers!

Put this in your figures then. Pretty much any mt bought today has components in it that are 100% replaced when the clutch comes due. With the subaru at a good shop with labor costs your looking at $1200 -$1400 for a full and proper clutch job done by a skilled and proper shop. I'm willing to bet the CVT is as reliable if not capable of going farther than most clutches these days. Very few people ever own a car long enough to find out. Then again there are some of us who do my 93 land cruiser has been doing the daycare run the past two weeks because gas prices are down and we've racked up some major miles on the new OB with a few road trips. The old 93 LC will probably still be around long after the OB has been crushed and shipped to china to be turned into toasters. LOL