iPhone IOS6 supports Bluetooth MAP!

[iainb]

Originally Posted by Darkanion

The issues YOU are complaining about date back to at least the 2010 model year and have been discussed quite a bit on this forum. If you had done some research, you would've known about them before you bought your 2012.

I did plenty of research prior to purchasing my '12. The Outback did everything else right so I was (and still am) willing to compromise with their crappy BT implementation. That doesn't mean I have to like it or can not complain at how bad it is.

[Kolenka]

Originally Posted by iainb

If I pair my phone and then try to pair as bluetooth audio the phone pairing gets over written and doesn't work.

The problem with this thread is everyone has a different configuration of radio and phone and the majority are not being clear on what specific models of both they have.

I've got a 2013, which may be slightly different. You are right that details matter.

Originally Posted by Darkanion

Well, actually... MY comment was about bluetooth connectivity and that IS Apple's screw-up. Just go check Apple's support forums.

Part of the problem is that it isn't clear cut and dry as to who is at fault with some of these issues. It's the joy of networked devices where different groups implement each end of the network. Bugs in one side can manifest in the other, fixes can expose bugs that were always there, etc. iOS 6 definitely has some bluetooth bugs, although in this thread alone I think i've seen 3 slightly different issues and not all of them are iOS-caused (mine wasn't, and neither was the thread corvettes linked).

"It doesn't connect" is a fairly broad symptom (kinda like fever in the medical field). There can be dozens of reasons why the connection/handshake fails with Bluetooth, but the symptom is basically the same without logs that help trace the root cause.

[Darkanion]

Originally Posted by Kolenka

Part of the problem is that it isn't clear cut and dry as to who is at fault with some of these issues. It's the joy of networked devices where different groups implement each end of the network. Bugs in one side can manifest in the other, fixes can expose bugs that were always there, etc. iOS 6 definitely has some bluetooth bugs, although in this thread alone I think i've seen 3 slightly different issues and not all of them are iOS-caused (mine wasn't, and neither was the thread corvettes linked).

"It doesn't connect" is a fairly broad symptom (kinda like fever in the medical field). There can be dozens of reasons why the connection/handshake fails with Bluetooth, but the symptom is basically the same without logs that help trace the root cause.

Agreed. There can be problems on both sides.

With the perceived limitations of Subaru's BT implementation, I was VERY surprised when the Lumia 900 I had chimed in (without me configuring anything, other than simply pairing it with the HU) to tell me I had a text message and would I like for it to read the message to me..

I was 1) surprised that the Windows Phone did something the "glorious" Apple device (iPhone 4 w/ iOS 5.x) couldn't do and 2) surprised the supposedly "limited" BT in the Subaru setup supported that feature at all. That told me these systems are more capable than we've probably given them credit for.. or been told about.

I still think most of the problems lie in the phones, not the headunits.. Not when the Windows Phone could read messages to me, have me 'speak' my reply to it, do the speech-to-text translation, read that back to me, and ask if I wanted to send it.. All without touching the phone at all.

Yes, we're talking apples (lowercase) & oranges about the functionality. But, I think most of the phones' BT implementations are hacked-on after-thoughts at best.. and I think that's where most of the limitations and issues come from.

Time will tell, as things evolve, though.

[Kolenka]

Originally Posted by Darkanion

Agreed. There can be problems on both sides.

With the perceived limitations of Subaru's BT implementation, I was VERY surprised when the Lumia 900 I had chimed in (without me configuring anything, other than simply pairing it with the HU) to tell me I had a text message and would I like for it to read the message to me..

I was 1) surprised that the Windows Phone did something the "glorious" Apple device (iPhone 4 w/ iOS 5.x) couldn't do and 2) surprised the supposedly "limited" BT in the Subaru setup supported that feature at all. That told me these systems are more capable than we've probably given them credit for.. or been told about.

I still think most of the problems lie in the phones, not the headunits.. Not when the Windows Phone could read messages to me, have me 'speak' my reply to it, do the speech-to-text translation, read that back to me, and ask if I wanted to send it.. All without touching the phone at all.

Yes, we're talking apples (lowercase) & oranges about the functionality. But, I think most of the phones' BT implementations are hacked-on after-thoughts at best.. and I think that's where most of the limitations and issues come from.

Time will tell, as things evolve, though.

Problem with that example is that feature isn't actually using MAP in that example. It's actually using the phone's built-in functionality, and opening a hands-free connection to the car to get your voice and play back. (iOS does similar with Siri)

The reason? Head units are a hodge podge of what they support and don't. About all you can really rely on is HFP (Hands-free), A2DP, and if you are lucky, AVRCP 1.3. My last head unit had a bug where the play/pause button ignored the play/pause state the phone was in. I assumed it was a bug in the phone. After digging into the logs and talking with other engineers, we quickly realized that the head unit was paying attention, but ignoring what play state the phone was in. Whoops. This was a top-of-the-line single-DIN from Kenwood too.

Yes, the iPhone couldn't do it, but that doesn't mean that Windows Phone was using MAP for it either (it does support it, but doesn't rely on it).

If you want to debate the details of this sort of thing off-thread, I'd be happy to. The reality is that both groups drag their heels, and working in the industry myself, it's kinda frustrating progress is so slow.

Another example: AVRCP 1.4 allows you to browse a device's media library over bluetooth and select what you want to play. Much like if you plug in an iPod/iPhone into USB on these head units. You'd think the aftermarket head unit guys would be all over this. Nope. The first implementation that I've seen to hit the market is iOS 6. Apple, one of the slowest to implement parts of the Bluetooth spec, beat everyone to this. Really???

[Darkanion]

Originally Posted by Kolenka

Problem with that example is that feature isn't actually using MAP in that example. It's actually using the phone's built-in functionality, and opening a hands-free connection to the car to get your voice and play back. (iOS does similar with Siri)

The reason? Head units are a hodge podge of what they support and don't. About all you can really rely on is HFP (Hands-free), A2DP, and if you are lucky, AVRCP 1.3. My last head unit had a bug where the play/pause button ignored the play/pause state the phone was in. I assumed it was a bug in the phone. After digging into the logs and talking with other engineers, we quickly realized that the head unit was paying attention, but ignoring what play state the phone was in. Whoops. This was a top-of-the-line single-DIN from Kenwood too.

Yes, the iPhone couldn't do it, but that doesn't mean that Windows Phone was using MAP for it either (it does support it, but doesn't rely on it).

If you want to debate the details of this sort of thing off-thread, I'd be happy to. The reality is that both groups drag their heels, and working in the industry myself, it's kinda frustrating progress is so slow.

Another example: AVRCP 1.4 allows you to browse a device's media library over bluetooth and select what you want to play. Much like if you plug in an iPod/iPhone into USB on these head units. You'd think the aftermarket head unit guys would be all over this. Nope. The first implementation that I've seen to hit the market is iOS 6. Apple, one of the slowest to implement parts of the Bluetooth spec, beat everyone to this. Really???

I don't know enough about how the BT stuff works (internally) to really "debate" it. I was just speaking from my own experiences. I hadn't even heard of BT MAP until this thread was started.

My main point was people claiming it's all Subaru's fault and I don't believe that to be the case. There's plenty of blame to go around.

[hebby]

I have a limited non-nav and also do not get the option of contacts etc when I sync my iphone 4s with the new software. Didnt have the opyions before i upgraded the ios either. think that limiting the system to 20 contacts is really lame especially considering that Japan is so tech focused and this being engineered there. What's the point of hands free if you have to look at your phone every time you want to call someone outside of your 20 person list? I will keep playing with it and see if I can get it to work but it shouldn't be this difficult.

Maybe they were thinking that less tech=less headache for us and them.

[SpiderM69]

I have a 2013 Limited with Nav, iPhone 4 iOS 4.2. It paired quickly, transferred phone book, streams audio. But it does not receive messages from phone. Dealer tried to get it to work and couldn't. A salesperson had a iPhone 4 iOS 6.0.1, that would pair and not receive texts as well. From the Apple website, iPhone 4 supports MAP. I'm going to call Subaru cust service tmw.

[cardsdoc]

I will be picking up our 2013 outback 2.5 sap tomorrow. Coming from a 2010 2.5 limited with nav. It is my understanding that the nav head unit is completely different than 2010-2012 (different manufacturer) so I think it's likely that only the 2013's with nav have the more advanced bluetooth features including contact sync and MAP.

[welsh12uk]

Here is what I've discovered in regards to the 2013 Limited with Nav. My old iPhone 4 with iOS6 connected via BT just fine. Apple's iOS6 has MAP which allows the head unit to receive texts and read them out. The previous iOS5.0.1 did not have MAP. The head unit in the Subaru isn't able to send a text reply back through the phone, any phone. It's my understanding that the text reply limitation isn't exclusive to Subaru (but I could be educated otherwise). When I purchased an iPhone 5 which has iOS6 I could easily get the phone to pair with the BT, however I no longer could receive texts let alone have the head unit read them out. I checked the settings on the phone to be sure that Bluetooth with the "Carmedia" device had notifications selected to "on" and it was. After spending two long evenings in the garage pairing and unpairing the iPhone5 I discovered something that enabled the head unit to receive and read texts. After you do pairing and go into Bluetooth settings on the iPhone 5>select Carmedia via right hand arrow>select notifications on, go back to general settings>select notifications>in notification center select "messages">in alert types select banner, not alerts. If this final step isn't performed the head unit will not receive the BT signal to acknowledge text receipt or to read it. I shared this discovery with my Dealers BT expert in Sales because he told me the new iPhone 5 didn't work like the iPhone 4 even though both had iOS6. I have heard that our2013 Outback brethren and sisters who have phones with the Android operating system are having worse issues.

[Amica44]

I just upgraded from iphone 4 to iphone 5 (IOS 6.0.1) and like many others had difficulty getting the phone and audio bluetooth to work like it did before. This thread helped me sort that out but I still can't get the iPhone settings screen that exposes the MAP options (e.g. texts and contacts transfered to the car).

I'm wondering whether the older versions of the NAV system don't implement the newer MAP profile. It looks like only those people with 2013 model cars are having any success.

My NAV information screen says it is Version 4.1 (2), though that may be the version of the DVD containing the mapping data. I wonder if Subaru can update the NAV firmware on older cars to enable this feature?