Interesting Day at the Dealer - Routine Maint / Manual Q's

[subiesailor]

3.6 has the timing chain - oil change interval is listed in owners manual but keep in mind your use - can shorten the max listed interval length.

[plain OM]

Originally Posted by GBMaryland

. . . .
As far as the service manuals: I like to know how my vehicles are constructed.

I also like to know just what's in a job when I take it to dealer.

The Owners Manual is decent, but it lacks certain technical details I'm interested in. More to the point, when I've asked questions politely, I've gotten different answers. It's interesting how "Sir, I really don't know, we'll need to check" doesn't come out too much:

- Do I have a timing belt or a timing chain?
- What is the factory recommend interval for changing the oil?
- Does the 3.6R require synthetic, that's what your sales guys told me?...
- When do the differentials need to have their fluids changed, and, unlike the coolant, does it require some special Subaru lubricant? [See, I actually did at least look at the Owners Manual... remembering is another story.]
- How long before I need to replace the cabin filters and the engine air filter?
- What is the next big service appointment I'm going to have and what, specifically, will need to be done?

I don't think these are uncommon questions...

My assumption is that these will be detailed in the service manual, along with the procedures for doing them.

The mechanical questions (e.g. belt or chain) will be apparent from the repair instructions in the service manual, as will "recommended materials" (there's a small separate sub-section on this in the General volume), but "schedule/mileage-related" questions (e.g., oil change interval) are not covered; instead this is covered in the Warranty and Maintenance booklet that should be with the Owners Manual.

[farf02]

Any 4 wheel drive vehicle can be sensitive to even wear. My dealer included 2 years of oil changes, and rotates the tires at every service. Also, remember todays softer tires are much more susceptible to 'cupping', proper inflatation and rotates will help you from having noisy tires as well. Why do you find it economically feasible to replace 2 tires only? If you keepthem rotated, you would get more life out of the tires, and you should ALWAYS replace all 4 on ANY 4 wheel drive.....and really, find a dealer you like and be respectful, it will go much further for you in the long run

[ScoobyRu]

Originally Posted by GBMaryland

...

- Do I have a timing belt or a timing chain?
- What is the factory recommend interval for changing the oil?
- Does the 3.6R require synthetic, that's what your sales guys told me?...
- When do the differentials need to have their fluids changed, and, unlike the coolant, does it require some special Subaru lubricant? [See, I actually did at least look at the Owners Manual... remembering is another story.]
- How long before I need to replace the cabin filters and the engine air filter?
- What is the next big service appointment I'm going to have and what, specifically, will need to be done?

I don't think these are uncommon questions...

My assumption is that these will be detailed in the service manual, along with the procedures for doing them.

Every single one of your questions is answered in the Owner's Manual under the "Maintenance Schedule" Chart. If there are lots of things listed under a certain mileage, then it's a "big" service appointment.

[JAvendan]

Originally Posted by GBMaryland

I will say the overall the stealership was pretty great. I may have to actually change my phrasology back to "dealership" now that I no longer own any Hondas.

well, let's not get crazy - lol.

i'm actually looking for an indie shop.

there are two in my area and will give them a go!!!

and, to be fair... my local dealership has been okay.

joel

[rasterman]

Originally Posted by GBMaryland

Interesting point about the circumference difference... I guess the only other way to fix that is to make sure your vehicle can be put into 2 wheel drive when you have a blow out, something to remember for the next car.

AWD vehicles tend to have restrictions on spare tire usage. Some require full size spares, some require the driver to engage a 2WD mode. A few require waiting around for a flatbed- no option to fix it yourself.

Older Subarus with the 4-speed automatic had a 2WD mode for just this reason. The 5-speed auto in your car is designed to be more forgiving of a temporary mismatch than the 4-speed, but if memory serves:

50mph hard maximum
50 mile total trip maximum
temporary spare allowed on the rear axle only- so if a front goes you need to move a rear wheel to the front and put the spare on the rear.

You should confirm these in your owners' manual.

Given how unpopular roadside tire changes are with the american public these days, I don't think Subaru is overly restrictive with these warranty protection rules. Personally I'm thankful that Subaru has not joined the fast-growing list of automakers who don't include a spare at all and simply sign you up for a roadside assistance tow club.

(other points from your posts well addressed by now)

[mxfrank]

It isn't four wheel drive that creates the need to rotate tires...it's slip control. If you have a RWD car with positraction, the same would be true for the two tires on the drive axle. The problem is that different tires may have different circumferences, and thus may turn at different speeds. The posi differential would react as if the smaller tire is slipping, and try to compensate. You end up wearing out the posi clutch. On a 4wd, the problem is tripled, because you have three differentials...one for each axle, and one center...which are provisioned with slip control. It's very important that you have four tires that are as close in design and treadwear as possible. Rotate regularly, change all four at once.

If you think your Subaru is expensive to service, try taking a Porsche to the dealer. But at least the Porsche won't handle like a hippopotamus.

[GBMaryland]

So, the two vs four wheels...

On a NON-AWD vehicle, IMO it's a load of poop [trying to be better about the swearing] to rotate the tires.

Consider this:

If you have a front wheel drive vehicle, you are going to wear out the front tires first. Period.

The rear tires, properly inflated, and properly aligned, will outlast the front tires 2 to 3 times as longer.

So, if you are putting 15k a year on the car, you're going to get about 2-3 years out of the rears, and repalce the fronts at least 1 time, probably 2. [This assumes you drive like me.]

The tires in the front will be the same as each other, and so will the rears.

Why would you put yourself in the financial position to have to replace four tires at every time you need tires, when you can just replace the front tires several times? Especially, when the rear wear indicator isn't close to being hit...

---

Now, if you have a rear wheel drive vehicle, the logic sorta goes out the window, as you're probably going to go through a set of tires a more regular intervals.

However, you are still repalcing them 2 at a time; tires should be repalced in sets in the rear and the front.

---

Note: I'm not talking about different brands in any of my comments. I'm talking about replacing the fronts or the rears with the same model and brand. I've sorta assumed that people would understand that. It's fairly obvious to me that if you are only replacing two tires, they still have to match the other two tires on the car. (Compound formulation, size, etc.)

What I didn't take into consideration with the AWD aspect was the example where different treadware results in a 1/4 inch difference from one differential to another.

That could be pretty significant.

[rasterman]

Originally Posted by GBMaryland

Consider this:

If you have a front wheel drive vehicle, you are going to wear out the front tires first. Period.

The rear tires, properly inflated, and properly aligned, will outlast the front tires 2 to 3 times as longer.

So, if you are putting 15k a year on the car, you're going to get about 2-3 years out of the rears, and repalce the fronts at least 1 time, probably 2. [This assumes you drive like me.]

The tires in the front will be the same as each other, and so will the rears.

The flaw in your logic is that when you replace the fronts, you will then (temporarily anyway) have better tread on the front tires than on the rear. That's a no-no, especially if it rains or snows where you drive. This is true regardless of the number of drive wheels. For spinout safety in a braking turn, you ALWAYS want more tread on your rear tires.

[GBMaryland]

Originally Posted by rasterman

The flaw in your logic is that when you replace the fronts, you will then (temporarily anyway) have better tread on the front tires than on the rear. That's a no-no, especially if it rains or snows where you drive. This is true regardless of the number of drive wheels. For spinout safety in a braking turn, you ALWAYS want more tread on your rear tires.

I have found that I destroy the fronts while not even coming close the wearing out the rears on any of the Hondas that we owned.

Where I live, there is no driving with snow... the local roads have never been plowed enough that I could even get out.

This is one of the reasons we now have an Outback and a Legacy.

I just really didn't want to buy them in the same year -wink-.

I'll just start a tire fund for replacing them all at the same time.