Help! Anyone else w/ these issues on the Harmon Kardon equipped Outbacks?
My rear door speakers & subwoofer DO NOT have ANY low-mid range sounds. I had a service ticket open w/ Subaru America & they closed it because "Sorry sir, they all sound shitty." (They used different words, but basically the same thing).
My dealer pulled out 3 new Outbacks (+ mine) & tested all stereos. They ALL have the same poor sound quality (or lack of sound) emitting from the rear doors & sub. I tried to explain to Subaru's customer service rep that my front dash speakers should not put out more bass than the subwoofer but they just don't get it. My local subaru dealer confirms it shouldn't sound like that, but since they all do, they don't know what to do.
My local car audio shop said it could be (1) bad subwoofer, (2) bad door speakers, (3) bad amplifier. Since so many cars have this issue, I'm assuming the assembly line guys just don't know how to properly wire the system. I haven't paid the shop to actually open up & diagnose yet because I paid $30K for this car already & Subaru America REFUSES to reimburse me if I do.
Somewhat related, my '16 outback 2.5i limited has an intermittent "sound reduction" where the front speakers will die for about 10 seconds. I'm trying to build the pattern for why. I thought it might be satellite radio related or when I'm accelerating (thus a speed compensation) but neither seem to be the case. Is anything similar happening to yours?
Subaru crapped out on these audio/ Nav units. Mine operates the same way. I have mine biased towards the back speakers and mid range ALL the way up.
Hopefully, Subaru will offer better units in future models. These units are certainly not worth what we paid / pay for them BUT I would be willing to pay more for a better system. A sad spot on a good car. I will not invest to change mine; just put up with it while I own the car.
Well there is no sub at all, just midwoofers on doors and near the rear windshield. But the front door ones can be felt on the pedals and armrest when up a bit loud.
I think the rear ones are simliar but I will check again. I do keep mid up all the way and bass up two notches.
Assembly line guys have nothing to do with it. The Harmon Kardon is not any high end stereo that has someone wiring up the amp. Like EVERYTHING else in the car, it is plug and play into the harnesses.
As already mentioned the limited does NOT have a subwoofer. It has a cheap 6" midwoofer with a mediocre amp. Realize 576 equivalent watts is NOT 576 watts that you buy from an amp at Crutchfield.
While I haven't heard your specific Outback or the other 3 the dealer had (quite impressive they had 3 Limited on the shelf), I will say when I listened to the Harmon Kardon I was quite underwhelmed. I replaced all the speakers (I have a premium w/o the silly center channel).
The front door speakers are 6"X9" and the rear "sub" is 6" round. So, technically, yea the front doors will put out more bass. 2X the speakers and they are bigger. I would be betting each channel gets about the same amount of power and/or if the "sub" gets more it is still not nearly enough.
The HK sound processor seemed to really push most of the vocals through the center channel making the tweeters (more) useless (they are not that good to begin with).
I have been meaning to post a write up on some of my upgrades to the sound.
One thing I have noticed, because the front are 6"X9", I have to fade back 1-2 clicks. Not saying your Outback and the 3 on the lot are ALL defective, but the sound from the HK is mediocre at best, and it is operating the best it can.
Wish I had documented mine. I have a Premium and only replaced the speakers so far but that in itself was a big improvement, not only in quality of sound but also quality of build. Planning on adding a small amp soon and hopefully an Android Auto-compatible head unit down the road once the product matures and prices are a bit more affordable.
Some of you folks would have been in a real tizzy if you grew up when I did.
Most cars came with an AM radio and single speaker. If you were real lucky you had a car like my first car ('61 Chevy Impala) that had a front and a rear speaker.
I find the radio in my '15 OB to be perfectly fine, as I would suspect most owners do.
You should compile a list of advancements made to base car technology over the past 55 years so that we can see all the parts and features that we shouldn't be complaining about. My '67 Cougar had manual lap belts so even if my OB's seatbelts aren't functioning as intended I shoud just be lucky to have them in the first place? Nonsense.
I got slammed a while back for mentioning that there are 2 different HK systems on the Gen5.
I had this experience back when I had one as a loaner car. The HK system in that 2.5 sounded like total crap!
The HK system in my Limited sounds WAY better!
The ONLY thing you can do is replace the speakers, as well as sub woofer.
There are several threads on doing this.
I missed this. Are you saying two different HK systems for the same year or different between '15 and '16? There should be a model printed on the faceplate toward the bottom-left and I'd love to know if there's a difference between yours and OP's.
My model on a Premium trim without navigation is FB685UM.
Some of you folks would have been in a real tizzy if you grew up when I did.
Most cars came with an AM radio and single speaker. If you were real lucky you had a car like my first car ('61 Chevy Impala) that had a front and a rear speaker.
I find the radio in my '15 OB to be perfectly fine, as I would suspect most owners do.
LOL, I was thinking the same thing! My first car was an 84 Mustang 5.0 with 4 speakers. Sound was a joke. You basically had it to add some noise to the already rattleing interior. This cheap HK system sounds beautifully to me :grin2:
I find the HK to be an average sound system at best. Nowhere near the quality on my old Acura TSX (non ELS) and certainly not in the same league as my old MDX with with ELS, but that is a much more expensive vehicle. I agree with others that the rear speakers need more juice. I have to keep it weighted a couple clicks to the rear. If it makes you feel better the Outback HK is way better than the JBL on our 2016 Toyota Highlander Limited. That system is piss poor, even in comparison to the JBL on our old 2012 Highlander Limited. With the Highlander there is little to no bass response and the rear speaks are nearly inaudible from the front. I had to send my 11 year old to the back to confirm that the rear speakers and "subwoofer" were even working. It may be interesting to note that the Outback headunit is very similar to the Toyota headunit. I read somewhere that Subaru is sourcing infotainment tech from Toyota.
The head units in our Legacys and Outbacks are sourced by Clarion (base trim) and Fujitsu Ten (Premium and Limited trims). Both are independent companies that supply OE audio/video/NAV/control systems to many automobile manufacturers.
I have absolutely no problems with this system, I don't ride in the back so those speakers are not an issue for me. It's not the best system but it is very capable once you adjust the levels properly.
Keep in mind, adjusting the equalizer makes a world of difference (some people forget that exists). I have never been satisfied with a sound system kept exactly level on all treble, bass, and mid ranges; they always sound flat and dull.
I got slammed a while back for mentioning that there are 2 different HK systems on the Gen5.
I had this experience back when I had one as a loaner car. The HK system in that 2.5 sounded like total crap!
The HK system in my Limited sounds WAY better!
The ONLY thing you can do is replace the speakers, as well as sub woofer.
There are several threads on doing this.
I was one of the posters that "slammed" you last year - wasn't my intent then or is it now either but....
I believe you posted back then you had a Premium as a loner with a HK system which wasn't very good. I pointed out - as well as some other posters - that this wasn't an option available on a Premium which I still say is the case for both 2015 and 2016.
That's not to say you could have had a one off version that did. I remember a poster on this forum who was able to buy a Titanium Metallic Outback with a black leather interior - probably the only one ever produced. Or could be your dealer actually did a custom install, if it was a Premium, with some HK components. But I don't believe that would be very common and unlikely to be the situation any other poster would encounter.
I found my 2012 3.6 Limited with HK stereo the audio was crap with that turned on (too quiet at stop, too loud driving) and when I turned it off it got a lot more consistent and enjoyable.
Typically I run with 25-30% on the "Bass" adjustment and I'm quite happy that way (but then I listen to Country music). If I turn the bass all the way up volume around 25-30 and let my friends play their dub-step stuff it shakes the whole car to the point the mirrors become useless from the intense bass making the whole car shake.
I know I also find the sound is a lot "flatter" with FM and 3.5mm aux-in compared to the dynamic tone of Bluetooth and satellite-radio (when it works...I ditched XM because it cuts out every time there's any tree in sight)
If you look at the faceplate on your stereo there will be a model number written in the bottom-left. It's more faint than the rest of the text but it's clear in the right light. Can you let us know what yours is? Curious if your head unit is the same as others in this thread with a Limited HK system.
@subietex
I guess you see what I'm talking about...
Your thread proves that there are 2 versions of the HK system.
I'll not answer any posters about it anymore. There ARE 2 different HK systems. I might have got the model correct, but I sure as heck remember it was A HK system, and it sounded like crap.
Anyway, Upgrading the speakers will go a very long way in improving the sound.
Well you'll be glad to know that you've been vindicated. I did some research and discovered that there are indeed two variations of the HK system for the OB - at least for 2016 but I would assume it was the same for 2015 but Subaru no longer has access to that info on their website.
Your previous posts about the HK system last year weren't entirely correct as you stated that the HK in the 3.6 Limited was better than the 2.5 Limited whereas they're both the same in the standard versions and both the same if you upgrade to the NAV version - NAV is optional on both 2.5 and 3.6.
This info was not that easy to find - looking at the 2015/2016 brochures it never mentions the 8 speaker - 440 watt version and neither do any of the research sites that I could find.
I think owners who bought Limited Outbacks without the NAV option have a legitimate beef with Subaru if they were under the impression they had the HK System with 12 speakers and a 576 watt amp.
Here's what appears in their 2016 brochue - believe it was the same in the 2015 as well - four columns left to right are for Base, Premium, Limited 2.5 and 3.6R:
It shows the HK 12 speaker 576 watt system as being standard - if it was optional there would be an "O" instead of a solid dot.
But on their website it shows that you really only get a HK system with 8 speakers and 440 watts.
Thanks to KentuckyOutback for helping to bring this to light.
Here's what you can try the next time you take it to the dealer. Fire up the Deadmau5 Pandora station. Doesn't matter which song, they all have heavy bass. If the three rear speakers are missing the bass, it will be very obvious.
I have a 2016 2.5i Limited. Happy with it so far. When driving it seems that I am hearing more sound from the front speaker on the dash than is ideal. I found the "balance" control and shifted sound a bit toward the rear but what I'd really like to do is shift more to each side and quiet down that front speaker. I don't want to hear more sound coming from the back and if we had passengers they would like want that. Is there any way to get a little less volume from that single front dash speaker?
I get better sound with the front reset cross hair set almost to the rear headrest. When I had my car full of camping gear on a cross country trip the rear seat speakers were blocked so I put toward front.
An advantage of setting toward back is you still hear radio when voice nav plays out the front speakers.
I think just about all cars up to $50K have lousy stock stereos. Better off just going with double-din after market headunit with hook-up's for back-up camera. Then replacing the stock speakers and get a decent amp.
I highly suggest to the OP and others contemplating adding amps, to read the following thread (http://www.subaruoutback.org/forums...-amp-speakers-sub-2015-outback-premium-9.html). Stavi and I and others on the LegacyGT website had discussed this. If you have the HK system with 12 speakers, the amp controls a bunch of other functions. Even one of the Subaru wiring guru's SVXdc (his website is ae64.com) is stumped by the new system.
Yes, the audio system is subpar but just upgrading speakers may work. I've decided to just keep it stock as making the move to aftermarket I would lose a bunch of the functions that I like, the eco monitor, tire monitor etc.
I got a breakout harness from SVXdc for my Premium to run some component speakers and an amp later on. He asked for pics of my unit which I sent him and attached to this post. The stereo system is the upper silver portion and the bottom black part is telematics.
What I found with even my unit (Premium, no nav) is that the wiring isn't exactly straight-forward. The pure white 16-pin (10+6) connector toward the left is the 8 speaker wires with some extras, e.g. power, ground, illumination. When I wired my system to test I only connected this and found that I had no sound coming from my front doors. Eventually I realized that the gray connector in the telematics system needed to be connected for those front door speakers to work; SVXdc suspected that it's for Bluetooth calling.
Point being that you're spot on about the additional complexities. If you're planning on doing work to the HK system outside of replacing the speaker endpoints then make sure you document your work and test all head unit functions, e.g. audio sources, BT calling, Starlink, before putting everything back together.
I have the non-Nav HK system in my Outback. I've always thought it sounded acceptable, but I did notice that most of the sound was coming from up front. Yesterday I faded all sound to the rear and it was nothing but mid frequencies. What a bunch of crap.
At some point soon, I'm going to look into replacing the rear mid-bass speaker (in the cargo area) and possibly adding an amp to it.
So according to the documentation pasted a few responses ago, you should have the 8-speaker config with a 440W amp. If you do happen to make any changes, check your dash corner tweeters and/or the rear door speakers and let us know if they are coaxial (two drivers on a single "speaker"). Alternatively, the amp is located under the driver seat so if you can see a label without removing the seat then let us know if it lists the wattage and what it's rated at.
Also note that the HK amp performs additional function so you might not be able to simply swap it out with aftermarket and retain all features.
I swapped from a 2010 UK (Japanese built) Outback to a 2016 UK (Japanese built) Outback. AFAIK they don't claim any heritage (HK or otherwise) for the system in this car. My first thoughts on turning on the radio in the new model - they've forgotten to connect the woofers! Fiddling with the equaliser and close listening showed that they were in fact connected, they just don't seem to do very much when playing radio or ipod via USB unless the bass and lower mid frequencies are boosted to the max.
Strangely however, the nav voice sounds much more as though the full frequency range is being utilised. It's the radio and other sources that have no bass and seemingly excessive mid/high frequencies.
Next time I'm in the dealer I'll ask if they've had other comments about this.
I checked the Service Manual Wiring Diagrams and both HK without Nav and HK with Nav have the same wiring schematic showing 8 speakers. So the difference must be that the 12 speaker set up has additional coax speakers that combine mid range with a tweeter and etc.
I checked the Service Manual Wiring Diagrams and both HK without Nav and HK with Nav have the same wiring schematic showing 8 speakers. So the difference must be that the 12 speaker set up has additional coax speakers that combine mid range with a tweeter and etc.
That is correct, I have a non-NAV unit and 8 speakers in 8 locations. As I mentioned, the sound stage up front sounds great, but behind the rear seats is massively lacking.
This should put this subject to rest - my reply from Subaru:
Thank you for taking the time to contact Subaru of America, Inc. and for your continued interest in Subaru.
The 2016 Outback Limited models come standard with 12 Harman Kardon speakers. This is for both models - with our without the navigation system.
We appreciate you bringing this conflicting information to our attention. I will notify our Marketing Department of the incorrect 8 speaker information on our web site in the 2016 Outback page.
Thanks again, George. Have a nice day.
Sincerely,
John J. Mergen
Subaru of America, Inc.
Customer/Retailer Services Department
1-800-SUBARU3 (1-800-782-2783)
Service Request Number: 1-15354732841
This should put this subject to rest - my reply from Subaru:
Thank you for taking the time to contact Subaru of America, Inc. and for your continued interest in Subaru.
The 2016 Outback Limited models come standard with 12 Harman Kardon speakers. This is for both models - with our without the navigation system.
We appreciate you bringing this conflicting information to our attention. I will notify our Marketing Department of the incorrect 8 speaker information on our web site in the 2016 Outback page.
Thanks again, George. Have a nice day.
Sincerely,
John J. Mergen
Subaru of America, Inc.
Customer/Retailer Services Department
1-800-SUBARU3 (1-800-782-2783)
Service Request Number: 1-15354732841