No you can't do what I do, I have AWD. A roadrage thread.

[Novablue]

So I feel kinda bad. But only kinda after what I did to a random stranger last night.

The setting:
Night time
2 lane road, rural
around 20* F
Black ice under the trees.
I'm doing 40 in a 30 mph (yes I'm speeding, at night in the ice)

As I'm going along I notice another driver is catching up quickly. With in several seconds all I can see is the windshield of his car in my rear view mirror (when most cars are 20 feet a way I can see their head lights). He's tailgating me, in the ice, at night.

That's when I had my moral dilemma.

Up ahead is a sharp turn... down a hill... shaded by trees. While the road we have been traveling on is mostly dried out I'm about 90% sure that corner ahead is ice. Many a car has use the guard rail as a track around that corner in my years living in the area.

So I did it, I took that 20 mph speed limit icy corner going downhill at over 8% grade at 35 mph. I can see the driver behind me desperately trying to slow down, but it's too late.

I cut the corner, the VSC light flashes and my car fish tails slightly and then... it happens. The guy behind me is riding the rail.

Oh, I made it out fine. I have snow tires and AWD and I knew where the ice spot was and avoided it.

He had a slightly lowered 90's Honda Accord that now has only one working head light and two silver metal "racing" strips down the passenger side of the car where the guard rail saved his life.

Now I feel kinda bad.

But only kinda.

I mean looking back, he could have been hurt. Then I really would feel bad.

[linkbelt1]

The way he was driving, he was going to get it sooner or later anyway!

[rasterman]

You had a tailgater who couldn't hold the road. What's the dilemma?

Not as if the guy had arranged or paid for you to be a guide on that roadway.

[Novablue]

Hahaha! I know it. Thing is I was fairly certain he would be riding the guard rail.

I only feel kinda bad (this is just who I am), just thinking about what "might" have happened. At the time I was laughing.

Not sure I feel bad enough to not do it again though. That's my current dilemma.

[jp1203]

I can't stand people who tailgate--especially at night. I keep a significant distance behind anyone at night (more so than during the day). Never know when a deer could run out, and even with snow tires I can't stop on a dime most of the time in the winter.

I wouldn't feel bad about what you did.

[jogosub]

It's called "roadrage" allright Novablue but I would do the same.... In EU they do a similar "stupid" thing. If a car in front of you does not move over (flashing high beams and using high power horn blaster), you pass him/her and then you slam the brakes in front of him; making sure you have enough turbo power to "burn rubber" so that he does not hit you.... LOL... next time (I would think) they will "move over"... not sure how would work that on an icy road though....
It's stupid and dangerous, etc,etc bla,bla bla...but then you feel better afterwards...

[AllWhiteOB]

What i don't understand is how AWD prevents you from sliding. Traction control yes, but likely the Honda had that feature too.
All i am saying, you had no way of knowing for sure you will stick to the road and he won't.
When you hit ice, it doesn't quite matter how many wheels are pulling. Try that corner with a 4x4 and you will know what I mean.
Overall, the guy behind you was an ******* and probably didn't learn anything from it, but why risk your life to teach a stupid guy a lesson he will likely never understand.
Subaru owners are people who can afford a more expensive car but are buying smart. Especially Outback owners. I haven't seen roadrage from an OB owner, because that's the profile ... That's why everyone here is so civilized too.
Get with the program! hahaha

[AllWhiteOB]

Sorry, should mention: I am not condoning you ... I tend sometimes to be just as bad. But next time think twice if you really have an advantage. I think this time you were just lucky. OB is a great car, but does not perform miracles.

[statueim]

Originally Posted by eugenlucan

What i don't understand is how AWD prevents you from sliding. Traction control yes, but likely the Honda had that feature too.
All i am saying, you had no way of knowing for sure you will stick to the road and he won't.
When you hit ice, it doesn't quite matter how many wheels are pulling. Try that corner with a 4x4 and you will know what I mean.
Overall, the guy behind you was an ******* and probably didn't learn anything from it, but why risk your life to teach a stupid guy a lesson he will likely never understand.
Subaru owners are people who can afford a more expensive car but are buying smart. Especially Outback owners. I haven't seen roadrage from an OB owner, because that's the profile ... That's why everyone here is so civilized too.
Get with the program! hahaha

I agree, the title of this thread is very misleading (however, I do not agree that the 90's accord likely had equivalent traction control--if any--or snow tires based on Nova's description). The snow/ice tires you are running played a huge roll beyond just having traction control on 4 wheels. I comment because I hate the myth that 4 wheels moving makes a car invincible in snow/ice conditions--particularly because I find it's the gigantic SUV/pickup segment that likes to tailgate me in severe weather and I highly doubt their stopping ability (who needs snow tires with 4WD/AWD, right? ... tisk tisk) as much as I would doubt this 90's Honda accord's stopping ability. What I don't doubt about these SUVs/pickups relative to a smaller Honda accord is their ability to cause a lot more damage with their increased mass/momentum should I need to stop in an emergency situation and potentially be more fatal to me.

I wish more people experienced non-fatal incidents in the snow to teach them a lesson about how dangerous their driving habits are. Nova, my only critique would be to try to think of a spot that is potentially less fatal next time to prove your point if its possible, but it's better that you lost the other driver around a corner than you ended up going off the road with him/her at some point (what if you had braked around the corner and they slammed into your rear because he/she couldn't stop?). Hopefully the other driver learned a valuable lesson through expenses/rising insurance costs of the incident--and I hope the lesson is not simply "I need an AWD vehicle so I can drive like that". Unfortunately, there is no visual indicator while on the road that a vehicle is equipped with snow tires, so people most likely see "that car has AWD and is able to drive like it's summer when rounding corners"--if only snow tires came with a bright neon badge akin to the "symmetrical AWD" logo on the back of our cars, then maybe more people would stop buying into the AWD as a cure-all for winter driving myth as much and start making practical decisions to make any car significantly safer in winter driving conditions.

[imwjl]

Originally Posted by Novablue

So I feel kinda bad. But only kinda after what I did to a random stranger last night.

The setting:
Night time
2 lane road, rural
around 20* F
Black ice under the trees.
I'm doing 40 in a 30 mph (yes I'm speeding, at night in the ice)

As I'm going along I notice another driver is catching up quickly. With in several seconds all I can see is the windshield of his car in my rear view mirror (when most cars are 20 feet a way I can see their head lights). He's tailgating me, in the ice, at night.

That's when I had my moral dilemma.

Up ahead is a sharp turn... down a hill... shaded by trees. While the road we have been traveling on is mostly dried out I'm about 90% sure that corner ahead is ice. Many a car has use the guard rail as a track around that corner in my years living in the area.

So I did it, I took that 20 mph speed limit icy corner going downhill at over 8% grade at 35 mph. I can see the driver behind me desperately trying to slow down, but it's too late.

I cut the corner, the VSC light flashes and my car fish tails slightly and then... it happens. The guy behind me is riding the rail.

Oh, I made it out fine. I have snow tires and AWD and I knew where the ice spot was and avoided it.

He had a slightly lowered 90's Honda Accord that now has only one working head light and two silver metal "racing" strips down the passenger side of the car where the guard rail saved his life.

Now I feel kinda bad.

But only kinda.

I mean looking back, he could have been hurt. Then I really would feel bad.

If you were pushing it on a public roadway in the presence of others you should feel bad and not do that.

We lost a family member because of the thoughtless driving of another. Yeah, the chances are not that high, but we know those chances exist painfully well. Trust me that the driver caught, first responders, medical staff, coroner and insurers all wish that moment of unsafe driving didn't happen if not exactly the same way we do.

If you want to push it do it in a sport where you may only hurt yourself, a simulator game or sanctioned racing.