Looks like Rock Auto has them for 187 w/ water pump. Do you think this is the way to go?

2002 SUBARU OUTBACK 2.5L H4 Timing Belt & Component Kit | RockAuto

 

Looks like Rock Auto has them for 187 w/ water pump. Do you think this is the way to go?

It's the way I would go. $37 more for a proper bearing is certainly peace of mind and far cheaper than an engine job should a low quality bearing fail.

If in a hard place, I might trust the cheaper bearing for a few years but certainly would not for 105 months/ 105 k miles. So then you have to look at time for the job: for an initial savings of $37, would you really want to do the timing belt sooner? Not me!

 

Warning-rockauto also has mislabeled boxes now. The Gates person I ended up speaking with (post video) tells me they're aware of the problem but neglected to do a recall or issue a statement. I'm disappointed in them all around.

 

Warning-rockauto also has mislabeled boxes now. The Gates person I ended up speaking with (post video) tells me they're aware of the problem but neglected to do a recall or issue a statement. I'm disappointed in them all around.

boooo Gates. Bad press. Bad form. If you guys didn't authorise this, you need to chew out your parts suppliers for giving you less quality parts and charging the same.

unless they aren't charging you the same, but you're charging US the same.

Boooo Gates. Get on this and fix it.

 

You've got to be kidding! Holy crap!

 

I have told this story before:

My local mom-and-pop shop owner told me he USED to install aftermarket Timing-belt pulley-kits until one failed prematurely. He covered the customers entire engine-rebuild out of his pocket. (cuz that is how he does business!!)

Due to that experience, now he ONLY uses factory Timing-belt components. (for each respective manufacturer)

Also beware that Subaru has changed some of their TB components due to identified failures. Some of the Subaru idlers now use DUAL bearings to maintain belt-stability and extend life.

Not many of the aftermarket kit sellers are even aware that Subaru has changed to using dual bearings.

 

Also beware that Subaru has changed some of their TB components due to identified failures. Some of the Subaru idlers now use DUAL bearings to maintain belt-stability and extend life.

Have you installed the Dual bearings pulleys? Do you know if this includes the tensioner and other timing pulleys? It looks like there are some Subaru OEM parts online sellers that will sell a little cheaper than the dealer. (not sure about shipping cost tho) Do you have any "gotcha"s about those kinds of deals?

 

I ran across this issue months ago - makes you wonder when they will run out of the 'misprinted' boxes.


goes back to at least June of last year;


from Amazon

Byrkbowenon June 13, 2016
Verified Purchase
For the price, this is a great kit. However, although the label on the box said each of the idler bearings (by part number) were made in Japan, the cog-type bearing (normally NSK) was made in China by Taide, and stamped with the Gates logo. While I am sure that it would function fine, I just do not trust a Chinese bearing, when everything else in the kit (except the timing belt itself) is OEM. The Taide bearing has a matt-black finish on the toothed surface, where the NSK bearing has a mirror finish. As I was able to get an OEM NSK bearing on eBay for $25, I went ahead and did just that. Just a couple of months ago, reviewers were stating that all of their idler bearings were Japanese, so I do not know if this is a recent change.

The package states that, if you break the plastic seal/film holding the contents in the tray inside the box, you will not be able to return it. But the labeling is incorrect, and you do not know what is inside until you break the seal. I know that Amazon would take it back, but I was not happy.

In the photos below, the idler bearing on the left (red seal) is what was received in the Gates kit, while the one on the right (black seal) was purchased directly from an NSK distributor. If you look at the stock photo associated with the kit, it shows one with the black seal as the part (Gates number T42024) included. That was not the case. Not a great photo, but you should be able to see the difference on the side shot, with the highly polished teeth on the right (NSK), as compared to the left (Taide).
review image review image review image review image

 

other than one or 2 of them having 'user hostile' websites, the 3 or so online dealers I've used have been good to exceptional.

I have also had a local dealer match, and 'nearly match' on-line dealer prices.

 

ASIN kit uses OEM parts, timiken bearings, mitsboshi belt, etc. It was $250 on amazon.

Just OEM waterpump from the dealer is $175.

 

That may work. Im doing my research a few months ahead of the change now. Ill check it out. Thank you!

 

For what it's worth I finished up conversation with a Gates rep via Facebook a few minutes ago. I wanted to copy and paste here to see what you all have to say about it.

ME: I need a timing belt kit for my Subaru. I have heard that you are putting chinese parts in your kits now--even though the box says "Japan." The word is getting around on the Subaru Forms that you are. Is that true?

Gates: Hi Robert, thanks for your question. Gates has two versions of kits for Subaru. One kit has OE components produced in Japan and another kit with OE quality components. Unfortunately some of the labels on our Subaru kits identified the incorrect country of origin for a short period of time. We have corrected the labels after learning of this inadvertent error.

Gates: All Gates kits carry the same industry-leading warranty, which can be found at Gates Website Limited warranty | Gates Corporation.

Me: Thanks for your response.

Gates: Of course. We hope this was helpful.

Me: Yes. It was really unsettling to see youtube videos of folk pulling out chinese parts that were labeled Japan parts. I have always heard about how great Gates head gasket kits are. I know Subaru cars are very particular about their parts. Again thank you for your response. If you have the labeling issue corrected and can assure that purchasers who choose parts made in Japan are delivered, I'll be happy to take that information back to the Subaru DIY forums to spread the word.
Can you supply me the part number for your japanese Timing belt kits? Again, thanks for your response!

Me: We greatly appreciate your perspective and position with regard to the parts you put on your vehicle(s) and assure you that Gates is hyper-focused on providing the absolute best parts for our customers' applications. The labeling issue has been corrected. Thank you for your willingness to help us continue to spread the word that Gates takes the quality of our products very seriously.

Me: If you can supply a part number for the Japanese kit I can put that out to all the Subaru Nazis on the forums also. ��


(I was just kidding about the Subaru Nazi comment. I really appreciate all of you on this forum.)

Gates: Thanks so much! We're in contact with the product manager for those parts and we should have that part number for you in a bit.


Me: sweet. thank you.

Gates:There are several kits for Subaru engines. Gates TC kits are very make/model/year specific. The OE kits have an “N” at the end of the part number. One example is the “304” kit. The version with Gates components is TCK304. That same kit with OE components is TCK304N.

Of course the kit for each vehicle can be found on the Gates catalog site, http://www.gates.com/all-search-tools

Let me know if you need more info.
Site Search Tools | Gates Corporation
Find what you are looking for on the Gates.com site through our site search functionality. Find all the information you need with a simple search.
gates.com

Me: That should be enough for now. Thanks so much!~

Gates: Of course! Please let us know as you have additional questions. Thanks for taking the time to reach out and let us answer your concerns. We appreciate you as a customer.

 

maybe someone with better google-Fu could confirm, but it seems like, a gates part number with an 'N' suffix might be OE 'design' (for us, that should mean japanese parts ?) and the same number without the N is OE 'improved' ?(substituted parts?)

like; TCKWP328N vs TCKWP328

 

To help address the N vs. no N part numbers, I started a thread HERE to find a work around to this issue as the N variant that is supposed to be comprised of OEM parts, still contains a Chinese made Tensioner. See the thread HERE that comes from a conversation with a GATES tech.

Hope this helps,
s

 

to me it seems like unless you just cant swing the extra 100 to 150, buy OEM from one of the online dealers.

I know there are 100's of 1000's of after market kits sold and installed, Gates, Beck Arnley, Conti, Delco sold, and the overwhelming run fine. But if your one the higher than OEM statistical failure, its a very bad day.

 

to me it seems like unless you just cant swing the extra 100 to 150, buy OEM from one of the online dealers.

This is a sad state of affairs, but thanks for posting this up. I still need to research the Gates belt, as I heard that might be Chinese-made now as well. Doing a whole motor because a shop used a cheap belt. Not doing that again. My mechanic swears by the Gates belts - that is all he will use.


I got my parts from SubaruPartsDeal.com. They were a lot cheaper than the dealer, and one of the cheapest on the net. There were a few cheaper, but not much. Importantly, they had a much better web interface. In particular they have the proper exploded factory drawings. Not just the weak sauce, often semi-generic one's that only sort of show you the parts and assemblies. They have some nice features, like the complete parts list with the drawing, so you can reference the related parts. Also clickable part number bubbles on the drawings, which then highlight the part in the parts list, so you don't accidentally click on the wrong item when adding to cart.


The parts lists have the updates, so you can order the replacement part number for items that got updated. They also let you confirm parts fit by cross referencing parts with the database, so after you select them, you can confirm they fit your model. Shipping was fast and reasonably priced, and they have great support, including online chat. The drawings and web interface were why I chose to pay a little more and use them, instead of other suppliers that were a few bucks cheaper.


Glad I went OEM on the tensioner - it is a much nicer part than the 'OE' aftermarket item. Have to go check it for double bearings.

 

Pics of a factory fresh, OEM Subaru tensioner. I cannot tell if it has double bearings. The OEM Subaru one is a LOT nicer. Sorry for the cruddy pics - I don't want to take it out of the bag, because there might already be one waiting for me at the shop, and I need to be able to return this one. Will edit for better pics next week.


And here is a link to a YouTube video of the inferior tensioner coming with the Gates kit now (fwd to 2:25):

 

It would be nice if the online line dealer sites bundled a kit. Does anyone know of a dealer that does this? It seems like like you add each part to your shopping cart.

Could someone list all the items you should buy for TB for a 2008 2.5L SOHC ?

 

I am just getting information from a reviewer on Amazon on Gates kit TCK307 (I purchased it in 2014 for my 2008 SOHC. The kit had all Japanese made components back then.)

NSK AA010 (subaru part number 13085AA080 -- sprocket pulley)
KOYO W01331627580KOY (idler)
NSK W0133-1652558-NSK (idler)
NTN W01331609420NTN (tensioner)

According to the reviewer, these are the sources of OEM Subaru timing components. Back in 2014, I did not note down the supplier information. Therefore, I am not 100% sure if above are the actual components. I appreciate if someone with more knowledge verify the above information. Hope this helps.

 

Has anyone used the Continental Kit?

http://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo.php?pk=7212988&cc=1440445&jsn=418