Oil filter or Head gasket?

[radgirl]

Hi all,

I know I posted about a possible starter issue a few months ago. That strange sound seems to keep happening. However, here is the latest. I had an oil change done about 2 weeks ago. Shortly after, the car was leaking oil in very small amounts. I took it back in and they found it to be a faulty filter and installed a new one. While under there, they noticed the left head gasket may be leaking.

Up until this morning, the car has been fine and not leaking a single drop. The last few days, we've had a nasty cold snap, like 0 for the low at night. However, I do keep the car in the garage where it stays about 30 degrees.

This morning I saw another leak spot, but this time it was the size of my palm. Now the last 2 weeks, the car hasn't dropped a drop of oil and the weather has been quite warm. Now that the weather has gotten FRIGID, I am seeing this oil leak.

Question, is it truly an oil leak or are we looking at a head gasket issue as was pointed out to me when I took it back in. The mechanic said that often, the head gaskets will leak with nasty cold temperatures. I did go under the car while she was on the lift and they point out the issue, but they are also unsure if it's actually the head gasket leaking slowly or if this is a faulty filter....again.

The oil spot is center under the car with one or two small drops off to the left.

The car just hit 93K and has not had the timing belt changed yet. Any thoughts on this would be very helpful. Please let me know if I need to provide further details.

Many thanks in advance.

[subiesailor]

Originally Posted by radgirl

Hi all,

I know I posted about a possible starter issue a few months ago. That strange sound seems to keep happening. However, here is the latest. I had an oil change done about 2 weeks ago. Shortly after, the car was leaking oil in very small amounts. I took it back in and they found it to be a faulty filter and installed a new one. While under there, they noticed the left head gasket may be leaking.

Up until this morning, the car has been fine and not leaking a single drop. The last few days, we've had a nasty cold snap, like 0 for the low at night. However, I do keep the car in the garage where it stays about 30 degrees.

This morning I saw another leak spot, but this time it was the size of my palm. Now the last 2 weeks, the car hasn't dropped a drop of oil and the weather has been quite warm. Now that the weather has gotten FRIGID, I am seeing this oil leak.

Question, is it truly an oil leak or are we looking at a head gasket issue as was pointed out to me when I took it back in. The mechanic said that often, the head gaskets will leak with nasty cold temperatures. I did go under the car while she was on the lift and they point out the issue, but they are also unsure if it's actually the head gasket leaking slowly or if this is a faulty filter....again.

The oil spot is center under the car with one or two small drops off to the left.

The car just hit 93K and has not had the timing belt changed yet. Any thoughts on this would be very helpful. Please let me know if I need to provide further details.

Many thanks in advance.

The most common issue of oil leaks after a change is caused by the oil change shop removing the crush washer on the drain plug and putting a rubber gasket on it. The end result will be nice drips under the car on your garage floor.

Head gaskets rarely if EVER leak oil and you do not want a HG issue... So check all the simple and most common issues first starting with the crush washer on the drain plug being replaced with a cheap rubber gasket. Most oil change places know by now that subaru uses a metal crush washer and if they do not have any - its best to keep the washer thats on there on it given they generally can last a couple of oil changes before needing to be replaced. If they indeed used a cheap rubber gasket - swing by your local subaru dealer get a few crush washers toss them in the glove box. Then stop by the oil change shop and tell them you have oil leaking since they changed your oil and ask if they used a crush washer on the drain plug. If not hand them the crush washer and tell them ALL subarus use crush washers on the drain plug and to fix it.

[radgirl]

I have confirmed my shop uses the crush washer, not a rubber gasket. Could it be that I was the lucky recipient of two faulty filters?

So, if this is a head gasket issue (and it sounds rare), thoughts on what I should do? Should I invest the money and get the car repaired?

I do not want to buy a new car. I really don't. First, I can't afford the payments and second, I really love my car.

[SE95]

Chances are the cost of having the head gasket repaired will be a lot less money than the value of the car, certainly a whole lot less than a new car. While they are in there, have the timing belt/components and water pump replaced as well, that way you get all of the big expenses out of the way at once and save on labor since they only need to go in once.

[radgirl]

Originally Posted by SE95

Chances are the cost of having the head gasket repaired will be a lot less money than the value of the car, certainly a whole lot less than a new car. While they are in there, have the timing belt/components and water pump replaced as well, that way you get all of the big expenses out of the way at once and save on labor since they only need to go in once.

SE95, glad you brought this up. The last time I was in the shop, we spoke about this very topic. I was quoted about $2200 for the whole deal: changing the timing belt, water pump, oil pump, oil pan, head gasket repair, and what he called an "engine seal". To me, it sounded like I was getting a refurbished engine (for the lack of a better term). Does that sounds right? What else should they do while in there?

Question, I am in a bit of a financial pickle for a few more months. Can I let the car go as is or should I address this issue ASAP?

[subiesailor]

First off - as I said HG issue rarely leaks oil. And if you suggest what the issue is a shop will say yes its a HG and be more than happy to charge you for a major repair.

The leak could be one of many things - valve covers common and possible, an oil filter simply not put on with enough grease on the gasket, they may have dumped some oil when refilling it etc etc etc.

If in deed the HG is leaking you can drive the car in that state for a long time AS LONG AS YOU check the oil on a regular bases and top off as needed.

If it is the HG number one thing to know!! The hands that do the HG replacement are just as important as the gasket its self!! You want a highly skilled shop with subaru experience and good customer feedback who will also warranty the HG work for 3-5yrs in writing!!! We see it all the time on this forum where people get HG's done poorly by some random shop and find they have leaky or much worse gasket issues a year or two later all due to the lack of skill of the tech who did the HG replacement. A good shop will charge you $1300-$1500 for the HG job and given you are almost due for a Timing belt they will suggest you do that while they have the car torn down. All of the pulleys and guides should be replaced when they do the timing belt replacement this will add about another $600 to your bill.

If the shop is GOOD! You will never have an issue with the HG again.

#1 Never tell a shop what you suspect the issue is - they will agree with you even if that is not the issue and its actually a minor low cost fix.

[radgirl]

Originally Posted by subiesailor

First off - as I said HG issue rarely leaks oil. And if you suggest what the issue is a shop will say yes its a HG and be more than happy to charge you for a major repair.

The leak could be one of many things - valve covers common and possible, an oil filter simply not put on with enough grease on the gasket, they may have dumped some oil when refilling it etc etc etc.

If in deed the HG is leaking you can drive the car in that state for a long time AS LONG AS YOU check the oil on a regular bases and top off as needed.

If it is the HG number one thing to know!! The hands that do the HG replacement are just as important as the gasket its self!! You want a highly skilled shop with subaru experience and good customer feedback who will also warranty the HG work for 3-5yrs in writing!!! We see it all the time on this forum where people get HG's done poorly by some random shop and find they have leaky or much worse gasket issues a year or two later all due to the lack of skill of the tech who did the HG replacement. A good shop will charge you $1300-$1500 for the HG job and given you are almost due for a Timing belt they will suggest you do that while they have the car torn down. All of the pulleys and guides should be replaced when they do the timing belt replacement this will add about another $600 to your bill.

If the shop is GOOD! You will never have an issue with the HG again.

#1 Never tell a shop what you suspect the issue is - they will agree with you even if that is not the issue and its actually a minor low cost fix.

My shop only works on Subaru's and nothing else. I was not the one to bring up the head gasket issue. When I took the car back in for the oil leak, they brought me into the bay and under the car and showed me exactly what was going on. They said THEY suspected a head gasket leak because there was oil in the area (left side) where that head gasket lives.

They did put in a new filter, but they also said they have been having issues with the filters leaking oil.

What I don't understand is why when the temperatures were warm and the filter was changed after the initial leak, all oil stopped. Then we had this cold snap for the last 3-4 days and the oil is back, right in the same spot. Is the temperature just coincidental?

I simply went in for an oil change and now I have a car that seems to keep leaking oil. I've never experienced this issue and am beyond frustrated.

[radgirl]

Originally Posted by subiesailor

First off - as I said HG issue rarely leaks oil. And if you suggest what the issue is a shop will say yes its a HG and be more than happy to charge you for a major repair.

The leak could be one of many things - valve covers common and possible, an oil filter simply not put on with enough grease on the gasket, they may have dumped some oil when refilling it etc etc etc.

If in deed the HG is leaking you can drive the car in that state for a long time AS LONG AS YOU check the oil on a regular bases and top off as needed.

If it is the HG number one thing to know!! The hands that do the HG replacement are just as important as the gasket its self!! You want a highly skilled shop with subaru experience and good customer feedback who will also warranty the HG work for 3-5yrs in writing!!! We see it all the time on this forum where people get HG's done poorly by some random shop and find they have leaky or much worse gasket issues a year or two later all due to the lack of skill of the tech who did the HG replacement. A good shop will charge you $1300-$1500 for the HG job and given you are almost due for a Timing belt they will suggest you do that while they have the car torn down. All of the pulleys and guides should be replaced when they do the timing belt replacement this will add about another $600 to your bill.

If the shop is GOOD! You will never have an issue with the HG again.

#1 Never tell a shop what you suspect the issue is - they will agree with you even if that is not the issue and its actually a minor low cost fix.

Subie, part of the cost I posted earlier did include all of the pullies and rollers as well. Does this sound reasonable for all this work? He needs the car for a full 2 days.

[subiesailor]

Originally Posted by radgirl

My shop only works on Subaru's and nothing else. I was not the one to bring up the head gasket issue. When I took the car back in for the oil leak, they brought me into the bay and under the car and showed me exactly what was going on. They said THEY suspected a head gasket leak because there was oil in the area (left side) where that head gasket lives.

They did put in a new filter, but they also said they have been having issues with the filters leaking oil.

What I don't understand is why when the temperatures were warm and the filter was changed after the initial leak, all oil stopped. Then we had this cold snap for the last 3-4 days and the oil is back, right in the same spot. Is the temperature just coincidental?

I simply went in for an oil change and now I have a car that seems to keep leaking oil. I've never experienced this issue and am beyond frustrated.

Oil filter is a can - with a rubber seal on the top of it. When its cold rubber gets hard and less pliable and will leak. Sounds to me like the oil filter is leaking simply from you description of temp related and seems to be tied to when the oil gets changed. Not uncommon to need a fair bit of heavy grease applied to the seal on the oil filter to get them to seal especially when its cold out.

[radgirl]

Originally Posted by subiesailor

Oil filter is a can - with a rubber seal on the top of it. When its cold rubber gets hard and less pliable and will leak. Sounds to me like the oil filter is leaking simply from you description of temp related and seems to be tied to when the oil gets changed. Not uncommon to need a fair bit of heavy grease applied to the seal on the oil filter to get them to seal especially when its cold out.

Subie, you are calming my nerves quite a bit. Thank you. Now, it's supposed to warm up pretty good here in the next day or so (into the 50's). I am supposed to take the car back in this Friday. If I see the leakage stop, should I bother with taking it back in? In all my years of oil changes and Lord only knows I have tons (we all have), I think this has happened maybe once.

It definitely makes sense if the rubber is contracting and is less pliable, therefore not creating the snug seal it should. If it stop, let me know if I should waste my time taking it back in.

I really appreciate everyone's help.