Cam seals / timing belt install

[Michael Aos]

Had my 2005 Outback XT 5MT in for the 105K.

I requested the tensioner, and all the idler pulleys be replaced while they were in there replacing the timing belt. Did the water pump too.

They had planned to replace 4x cam seals too, but found that the little plastic (?) "thing" around a bolt for the cam had previously been severely mangled and said the existing cam seals looked fine anyway.

They discouraged me from having them tear into it.

Should I be concerned? My intent was to a "do it right" 105K service, as opposed to simply replacing the timing belt that the dealer quoted me.

[grossgary]

They aren't steering you entirely wrong. The newer seal materials are robust and capable of high miles with few issues, particularly something as new and consistently used/maintained as yours - it hasn't sat and degraded the rubber compounds (hopefully).

That being said they can leak, it's low percentage though. So it's a very low risk. You're both right (or wrong depending if your a glass half empty/full type LOL)...You aren't likely to have a problem, but would have been wise to get a new seal in there while it was easy and nearly guarantee another 105,000 miles for a $5 seal.

*** The more important question is what is this "thing" that's mangled and why couldn't they deal with it? Timing covers break, degrade, etc...but it's always resolvable, the only complicate stuff is the belt gear which they already had off - after that it's just a sprocket and timing covers, not a big deal?

My guess is they were slightly more concerned (and rightly so, i totally get it) to just get it done and not mess around with more parts, asking you what to do, so they just made a decision and rolled and that was the easiest one - roll it out, make room.

[Michael Aos]

The plastic "thing" kind of looks like a sprocket.

I think you're supposed to hold it with a special Subaru tool that kind of looks like a giant spark-plug wrench.

There is a bolt head in the middle of the "sprocket", and you use the special tool to keep the "sprocket" from turning when you break the bolt loose.

[Michael Aos]

Originally Posted by grossgary

*** The more important question is what is this "thing" that's mangled and why couldn't they deal with it? Timing covers break, degrade, etc...but it's always resolvable, the only complicate stuff is the belt gear which they already had off - after that it's just a sprocket and timing covers, not a big deal?

It's in the paperwork as "cam pulley". It looks like a great big nut (2", 3"? metric equivalent) that's integral to the "cam pulley". You're supposed to hold it with a very large special wrench while you loosen the bolt in the center. That big nut looked to me like it was made of plastic, and it's stripped pretty badly.

[tdelker]

This is inconsistent with my picture of the cams. For good pictures see this: http://legacygt.com/forums/showthrea...106809p10.html

[Michael Aos]

Originally Posted by tdelker

This is inconsistent with my picture of the cams. For good pictures see this: Timing Belt Replacement 2.5T - Page 10 - Subaru Legacy Forums

The cam sprocket itself has an integral "nut" or shape (torxy?) that you're supposed to hold with a big special tool.

That was all stripped.
--

[ScoobyRu]

Do you know why it would be stripped? What work has previously been done to the car?
I'm inclined to think that they stripped it, but I'm not a very trusting person.

[Michael Aos]

Originally Posted by st3mpy

Do you know why it would be stripped? What work has previously been done to the car?
I'm inclined to think that they stripped it, but I'm not a very trusting person.

No, I don't know why someone would have been in there previously.

I asked the mechanic that specifically -- under what scenario would someone have already been in there.

His first suggestion was maybe someone tried to do the 105K previously, but I'm pretty sure that's not the case.

Then he suggested maybe someone repaired a head gasket. It's my understanding that the XT's don't have the typical head-gasket issues that the NA 4's do.

He showed me several cell-phone pics.

They seem like a pretty good small shop. They have one guy who works on Subaru's.

I'm kind of with you though -- it's not outside the realm of possibility that they messed it up.

[Michael Aos]

Originally Posted by tdelker

This is inconsistent with my picture of the cams. For good pictures see this: http://legacygt.com/forums/showthrea...106809p10.html

I'm probably just describing it poorly.

The "cam sprocket wrench" wouldn't work because the multi-sided shape it was supposed to grab was stripped.

Here's a picture from another forum of a different car -- just to show the shape of the piece I was trying to describe.

[Seabass]

Wait, is that a pic from your car? That broken sprocket can't be good!