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2004 Toyota Sienna, miss my eyesight. Life moves on.
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Ok I've been here for a while as a Legacy owner but in a matter of 24hrs I converted and did not see it coming. This will probably be long and not the best written piece I've ever done but I'm tired and I spent a lot of time at the dealership.

Background: I bought my May build 2011 Legacy in June of 2011. I loved it at first but over time I grew to not love the steering feel or lack of. I did love the rest of the car. End effect is I just liked it. My dealer had a Limited Legacy coming in next week for me but I got a brilliant idea to look up how much more Eyesight was than just having a moon roof. Invoice is only $2400 more and considering the backup cam, home link, nav and Eyesight I talked to my wife and we felt that OK thats not bad and they have one in stock now. My sales guy was going to be in Wed so we'd wait for him as I've learned patience pays off. This was Monday.

Last night at 10pm my wife asked if we should get an Outback. Now we have a Suburban and this conversation has come up before but as she's standing there 8 months pregnant with our second she's thinking of times the Legacy trunk wasn't quite big enough and we had to take the Suburban. We love our Suburban but she didn't want to be forced to use either rig because we decide to do or buy something on impulse in the middle of the day. Plus she can curb tap the tires to park it. Thats a no no in the Legacy. So we decided we'd look at both. (Glad I didn't rush out Monday!)

Tonight: We looked at a pearl white Outback and a graphite grey Legacy. I gotta say the Legacy looks good, really good in my eyes. I also really like the wood trim on the interior of the Legacy more as well. Oh and yes the wheels...much better than the OB wheels. But at the end of the day with a family growing in a few weeks, the do anything utility of the Outback won out. We've always thought that the white against the black plastic stood out to us so there was no question on the exterior but the interior made us hesitate. However since the carpets are black we figured screw it, we like it and we're not gonna dwell.

Price: 2.5 Limited with Eyesight, Nav, Moonroof. Accessories where body side moldings, rear back seat plastic protectors, rear bumper cover, puddle lights and splash gaurds. We got the car for Invoice of 31,900. (I'm rounding a few bucks) GTP 21,475. As others have said, and I've said, I'm happy with my price even though I could have done better. I don't have time to fight for pennies. I financed it at 2.9% 72 months through the dealer. My local credit union has a promo of 2.24% and 1% cash back on the balance transfer so once I get the registration in the mail I'll transfer it over and use the saving to get the wheel arch molding and tint the front windows. Well I won't get that much but thats what I'm thinking I want to do. I didn't get any extended warranties or anything. I'll wait till 30k miles and decide then what I want to do.

Impressions, I'll try to avoid the obvious stuff but I will state that tonight was kind of stressful. I bought a car previously that in the end wasn't for me and I missed some key points about it. There was a lot of pressure from my wife to get it right this time because even though she wanted the OB she would have looked at something else as well. So here goes.

Steering feel: This is what started it all for me. My car had numb thick steering that didn't center itself. It was not a wanderer, it did not shake it, just didn't talk to me. This has been fixed now good enough for me for the 13. I noticed immediately that the new steering wheel is a little thinner in diameter. I may be but nuts but I swear it is. The next thing I noticed was the steering had more play off center, not slack but it wasn't thick and sticky. Driving the car it has a nicely weighted steering feel, its not what I would call stiff but this car is still far from my Suburban or a Toyota. Its not weighted lightly. However as soon as I started to move the wheel it wanted to come back to center better. If I flick the wheel to the left or right it will mostly recover. My Legacy never did this. I also noticed that I felt more control through the wheel. My Legacy felt like moving a tight Xbox controller. Turn the wheel and the car moves but I didn't "feel" any interaction. In summary my car felt like they were covering something up, (Shake TSB), this car felt like it drives the way they intended it to. I am aware that the OB is 16:1 steering and the Legacy is 14.5:1 and that the tire profile is different. But I lowered the tires to 36/34 on the lot and I'm telling you its different.

Ride Quality: Love it!!! My Legacy road and drove great, no complaints. This just feels more solid and less jittery (rebound settings). For me they got it right. If I want a cad I'll buy a cad. I didn't even notice on the drive but I realized afterwards how quiet my wife and I were talking to each other on the freeway so the road noise is less.

Cornering: My Legacy had the 19 RSB rear sway on it and for a family sedan I loved pushing it in turns. I could tell the rear was a little out of balance with the front sway but hey it was fun and cornered flat. The OB doesn't corner as good as my Legacy did but guess what, its close! Best of all the chassis feels balanced front to back. I'm not going to change the rear sway on this one. I went through a round about as fast as my pregnant wife could take and I can live with what body roll it did give. Compared to my sisters 2011 OB its night and day. The 13 is just more composed.

Motor/Trans: My 2011 Legacy is faster than my sisters 2011 OB. The 2013 OB is quicker than my 2011 Legacy was. Maybe not 0-60, but zipping around town I had to make a point to get the RPMs to 4k. (Max I'll do pre 1k miles). Its not a diesel but its the closest I've felt a non turbo gas motor feel when the RPM is between 2-3k. Its got torque galore for how big it is with AWD. I'm very happy with the pickup and climbing as I live on top of a steep hill. I played with the paddles and while they feel better the D mode is so much better I won't need them. The car feels like its in gear now, less CVT like. Its closer to a manual transmission. Its not quite but thats how you need to imagine it. They're getting closer to creating the best of both worlds. I noticed a motor/trans whine at first that got a little lower on our 40 mile test drive but I don't care.

Eyesight: Very happy as its not overly intrusive. I had to actually get ON the line to get the lane departure warning to go off. I swerved left right left and no sway warning. It never got confused in turn lanes and pulling out either. They programmed it conservatively so if you get lane departure warnings you deserve it. Braking...didn't test it. We never got ballsy enough and the dealer was busy. I did try to get my wife to run me over but when the alarm went off she chickened out and hit the brakes vs letting the car do it. Adaptive cruise control. Love it but need to read up on a few things. It works as advertised and is really easy to use. It will get used 6 days a week so it helps justify the cost. However I don't like it beeping at me though every time a car moves in and out of range. Shutup, I don't care, just do your job. Also I set cruise at 60 and pushed the plus button and it bumped to 65...no I wanted 63. I'll have to play around.

Nav: Didn't want it but had to take it. That being said though it looks nice. Responds well, can play divx and .mp4 files, and a host of other stuff. If I have to get stuck with something it could be worse. At the very least the backup camera is sweet on that 7" screen.

Summary: My complaints against the Legacy are gone to my satisfaction. Its not exactly how I would tune the car but good enough. With the suspension revisions, and new motor/trans, I don't feel punished in giving up my Legacy in the handling department. We're going camping tomorrow but one day has thunder storms coming and I'm not risking hail damage. So she'll sit under the carport tucked away nicely awaiting her first coat of wax when we get home.

If you have questions PM me or response so everyone can see. Multiple sales people commented that they may pay me to come in and talk to customers as I knew more than any of them. I was the 2nd person to get Eyesight there but the first to take it home as the other one was ordered.

Oh I got to see a SAP Brilliant Brown in person, its very nice and a car that needs to be seen in person. It's not for us but I think Subaru needs to keep that color going all year.

Time for bed I think I know what I'll dream about tonight. :roadtrip:
 

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Ride Quality: Love it!!! My Legacy road and drove great, no complaints. This just feels more solid and less jittery (rebound settings). For me they got it right. If I want a cad I'll buy a cad. I didn't even notice on the drive but I realized afterwards how quiet my wife and I were talking to each other on the freeway so the road noise is less.

Cornering: My Legacy had the 19 RSB rear sway on it and for a family sedan I loved pushing it in turns. I could tell the rear was a little out of balance with the front sway but hey it was fun and cornered flat. The OB doesn't corner as good as my Legacy did but guess what, its close! Best of all the chassis feels balanced front to back. I'm not going to change the rear sway on this one. I went through a round about as fast as my pregnant wife could take and I can live with what body roll it did give. Compared to my sisters 2011 OB its night and day. The 13 is just more composed.
Totally agree with you on this, I drove the 2012 Legacy and 2012 OB earlier in the year, and just bought a 2013 OB CVT (had it for a week) and the 2013 OB seems more planted, more level during corner, and less bouncy than the 2012 Legacy which is lower to the ground.

The other day, on the 270 degree semi-tight off-ramp, I decided to follow a Mercedes AMG (don't recall the model) which was driving above average speed for a ramp like that, I thought I'd see if my 2013 OB could follow, and it did pretty well. I had all four windows closed but could still hear the tires screeching going through the corner, no unpleasant feeling of of under- nor over-steer, and car stayed fairly level throughout. Had I taken the same turn with out 2003 Mitsu Galant, the car would have tilted badly and greatly under-steered. The AMG was trying to outrun me on the offramp, but was able to keep the gap between myself and the AMG. Unfortunately, I did not record the speed I was going at, but will have to do that next time. Overall, very impressed of the cornering capabilities of the '13 OB. Now curious about the '13 Legacy....


Motor/Trans: My 2011 Legacy is faster than my sisters 2011 OB. The 2013 OB is quicker than my 2011 Legacy was. Maybe not 0-60, but zipping around town I had to make a point to get the RPMs to 4k. (Max I'll do pre 1k miles). Its not a diesel but its the closest I've felt a non turbo gas motor feel when the RPM is between 2-3k. Its got torque galore for how big it is with AWD.
Funny you compare to diesel, that was my thoughts exactly. The 2.5 in '13 CVT kicks in very well at around 2k rpm. I know the max limit it 4k rpm first 1000 miles, but with 200 miles on our '13 OB, mostly city driving, going mostly to 2k rpm and occasion to 3k rpm has been pretty sufficient. Once the speed exceeds around 40mph, I think the incremental power tapers off a bit, probably because of the flatter torque curve of the new 2.5.

cheers,
plex :cool:
 
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