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2015 2.5 towing 7x12 trailer advice

12K views 25 replies 11 participants last post by  nextbench 
#1 ·
So are are planning an epic 2 month cross country trip from Toronto to California in our 2015 2.5 and other trips through the Adirondacks and Rockies in the future. High altitudes, high temperatures - you name it.

2 adults 2 teenagers. We’re shopping for a camper but I’m 6’4” so don’t fit in many standard campers and big campers quickly creep overweight, I don’t want a popup or anything requiring much setup. We’re pretty rugged and don’t need amenities like bathrooms/showers or even loaded kitchens but my wife wants a comfy mattress for that long of a trip. The plan is to buy a 7’x12' cargo trailer and customize it with RV door, 4 windows and other basic comforts factory installed. Easily less than half the price of a decent sized camper trailer too. This way I can stand in the 6’6” tall trailer, we can set it up the way we want and also carry 4 mountain bikes (car roof or maybe off the back of the trailer) and other outdoor gear, maybe even kayaks up top.

The trailer we are looking at is 7’x12’, the overall outside height will be close to 100”, vnose. The dry weight is 1600 lbs and hitch weight is 160 lbs so well below the 2700lb/200lb max but all the gear will eat up a fair bit of extra weight.

I think 7’ wide is pretty standard for lots of campers but the trailer salesman suggested to do 6x14 instead for better handling - I would muchly prefer a 7x12 trailer instead of 6x14 (way better use of space if I can sleep side to side) but the salesman said he wouldn’t recommend it - thoughts?

And I plan to get trailer brakes but there seem to be several different kinds, some involving installing controllers on the Subie - any recommendations?

Does any of this sounds nuts? Is this trailer too tall to comfortably tow? Any other recommendations I should consider about engine cooling, sway bars or just general advice for towing a large trailer?
 
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#2 ·
Too heavy too big for your planned gear and teens. Sorry. Go smaller target 1200lbs empty and put pipe berth bunks that fold up on each side of a 5x6 and it would work. 7x12 is way too big.

5x7 would be about max regarding windage and empty weight vs your load carrying ability. 1800lbs loaded is about as max heavy as you want to go for that trip. My rig is 900lbs empty and about 1400 loaded by design on the west coast. My 1800lb all up boat was just too much for the long hot climbs. So when we set up our road triping camping rig my max empty trailer weight was 1200 packed I was targeting 1600lbs or less ideally 1300.
 
#4 ·
#5 ·
ok, those pipe berth bunks are cool! not sure if its possible to fit 4 people in a 5x8 trailer even if we use those, would be packed in like sardines :)

you suggest 1200lbs empty is the max, looks like that allows up to 6x12 single axle by the manufacturer I'm looking at (1100lbs) so if targeting 1200lbs I can still get away with 6x12 trailer - why go so small as 5x8 which is 820lbs? I can't see how we can all fit in a 5x8 trailer!

If I add up the weight of the 4 of us, plus bikes, plus full cooler, assume 50lbs of gear per person, all our gear I think I would be hard pressed to hit over 1500lbs, although I might surprise myself.

I did poke around on the forums to see what loads others are carrying, http://www.subaruoutback.org/forums...-6x12-u-haul-enclosed-trailer.html#post406964 seems to have been able to pull a 6x12 with motorcycle and gear inside.
 
#6 ·
the vehicle "can" do it.

this is not black/white nor is there a a mysterious line where one more pound and all of a sudden the vehicle can't do it. it's a parabolic curve of some sort (differential equation actually). as you add weight and size, safety decreases (worse handling, worse braking) and cooling needs increase, mechanical components are taxed.

so of course it's just an endless discussion of possibilities and nuances, there is nothing concrete here, not even in the "tow capacity" limits suggested by Subaru, though they are excellent resources, guides, and starting points.

the thread you linked - yes it can do it. he doesn't say when but posted in march - this might imply light temperature loads. and assuming he traveled I81 from MD south which it sounds like he did - i've done that trip about 50 times and the grades are relatively light compared to a lot of other Appalachian or rocky mountain treks.

5x8 - that's basically a sheet of plywood, sounds like a terrible idea.
 
#8 ·
Go rent a 6x12 though keep in mind many places will only rent a 6x12 to a person towing with a full size or mid sized truck based suv.
Ive towed several over the years even with my Land Cruiser and 4runner they were like dragging a parachute behind the vehicle. 2000 mile for fun trip? No thanks. 5ft wide trailers are dramatically more enjoyable to tow especially with the Subaru. 6ft wide and 12ft long no thanks. Even a 5x10 would be superior in a big way.

Given the miles your covering you want a trailer that tows ok behind the Subaru regarding drag load weight is only a portion of the factors involved.
 
#9 ·
Interstate Cargo Trailers from R and P Carriages

Also keep in mind most trailers like these are designed to ride with cargo in them. One that is packed light only a few 100lbs is going to bounce and hop all over the place behind the car which jerks the car around and does not make for a smooth ride. 2000 miles chances you would end up either selling it or gutting the suspension mid trip and swapping some torsion axles on it to fix your bouncing down the road rough ride.
 
#10 ·
If you buy new the trailer shop might swap in torsion axles for you as part of the deal. The standard leaf spring axle will be a rough and annoying ride with an essentially empty trailer especially if its a 3500lb axle. I run a 2000lb leaf spring/axle on my 4x6 900lb empty and I'm looking into adding shocks or swapping to torsion axles to reduce the bounce issue when packed light. My trailer was designed to haul a 500lb ATV but we pack gear bins on it for about 300lbs of gear.
 
#12 ·
You can also install tip out beds on the sides to increase sleeping space.

Also, have you looked at Livin Lite trailers?
Camplite Ultra Lightweight All Aluminum Travel Trailers | Livin' Lite RV


There is not that much more to setting up a popup over a camping trailer. Maybe 30min additional set up time.

The length of the trailer will not make as much difference as the height and width. The larger the rear surface area the greater the drag (it is not how you cut the air as much as how the air is put back together). If you do convert a cargo trailer put all the great inside the trailer to reduce drag. All the stuff hanging on the outside will really increase the drag.
Also, most 12ft+ cargo trailers have tandem axles (4 tires) and heavier frames, so you might have to custom order the trailer. But you want to weight al of your gear first to determine if you are with in the OB weights.

For 2 months, count on 75lbs of stuff per person + the adventure gear (20lbs per bike, 60per kayak with gear). I would not be surprised if you came up with 800lbs of cargo.

While I want to say to use the OB and go for it, it is not a good vehicle for the job. The tow rating is just to low for 4 people. if it was 2 people, it would be due able.
 
#13 ·
Thanks for the additional suggestions.

My kayaks range from 14-19' so inside is not an option but that would work well for the bikes and one less thing to worry about when traveling and parking at restaurants on route.

I'll admit, I'm quickly downsizing my plans for the trailer but my wife is not for it thinking there simply won't be enough room in a 5' wide trailer of any sort and too claustrophobic. I'm rethinking the whole popup trailer after looking at these Quicksilver ultra lite trailers, they sure aren't my grandmas popup.

More research... more research... thanks for all the suggestions so far.
 
#14 ·
For sure the pop up is the better route for sleeping space vs drag footprint behind the car. Again go LIGTHER!!!! This is my rig 4x6 about 5ft.6inches wide fender to fender and when not packed the top of the trailer is even with the bottom of the rear window on my 2010. 900lbs empty and 12ft long we can fit in any car campsite even the tight one's which has been especially good during our summer trips where camp site options were limited to zero regarding getting a larger space etc. Also as pointed out your added gear weight will be more than you expect especially if your hauling boat gear and bike gear along with food, clothing and at least some basic water etc.

This is my rig
Original LifeTime Tent trailer shares the same design idea with the Jumping jack trailers but its lighter. Its not a quick set up and tear down program takes 10-15 minutes to unload the top deck, another 10min to pop the tent. < its not the same as the Livin lite or more tradditional pop up trailers given we can haul gear on the top of the trailer. The down side is set up time is longer. The new modern pop ups are fairly fast to set up 10min or so. Then you have the time involved setting up the camp cooking food stuff etc. Generally takes me 45minutes to pack up but I don't have older kids to help so its just me with the wife chasing around our young kids. Older kids would cut the time some if they are assigned packing and unpacking jobs etc. Packed light no bikes on the roof we typically average 21-22mpg tank averages at 65-70mph speeds trailer is probably 1200lbs. We just did a two day local coastal trip last week we had parents bikes on the lid each side of the roof box along with the kids bikes on the trailer, our trip tank average was 19.5mpg speeds were typically 65-70mph. When I was towing my sleek racing sailboat it was 1800lbs all up required gear and trailer total - it sat dead even with the roof line of the car it was 26ft hitch to stern on the trailer and max trailer width 8.5ft wide. Its profile regarding wind drag was very similar to 6-7ft wide pop up trailers in the 1200lb+ range I typically saw 16-19mpg averages and rare occurances of 20-21 mpg averages on the flats 65mph and under. Power wise the 2.5 was fine though cooling capacity on hot stretches and decent climbs was the primary concern. With my 4x6 trailer by design I was targeting the smaller size so we could go anywhere cooling is a non concern and mileage is high enough to justify taking the Subaru over my truck which will return 16-17mpg towing the trailer with much greater climbing and cooling capacity etc.

SubaruOutback.org Member Galleries - Message
 
#16 ·
I tow a 6 X 12 V-Nose enclosed trailer with my '06 H6 OBW. It HATES it. I get 9 - 10 MPG, and revs way too high in 3rd gear. Even shifting it manually does not help with the MPG.
I'm getting a bigger SUV (Grand Cherokee) next year to tow with. I suggest you don't do it.

EDIT: I did add a trans cooler to be safe.
 
#17 ·
^ this is the issue with the boxy trailers when you start getting beyond the 5.5ft wide width and your height is taller than the roof line on the car the wind drag take a big hit on the vehicles ability to haul it at highway speeds.

For some what sleek lower profile trailers and not towing in 100+ degree temps at highway speeds with either head winds or long climbs the stock cooling system so far seems to be just fine with sub 1800lbs in my experience though to keep it out of the potential trouble zone I like to keep my towed weight under 1400lbs on my 4x6 trailer. That and mileage is dramatically better which is more or less the point of using the Subaru vs my truck for the road trip. Even having three large bicycles on the roof you see a considerable impact on highway performance regarding maintaining speed and more throttle needed and higher fuel burn all simply due to the drag factor.
 
#18 ·
I was warned that it probably would not do well with such a big trailer, but I chose to ignore those warnings.
I run close to 3,000 pounds loaded (it has electric brakes) but even unloaded the MPG drops to 10 or 11. It does handle it, and I take it easy when I am towing, but it definitely does not like it. I imagine that if I did this regularly that I would wear the car out quite quickly. The longest trip I have taken with it has been 4 - 5 hours, early early morning to avoid the midday heat. I allow extra time so I can keep it around 55 - 60 MPH. I probably only tow a handful of times / year. I would tow more frequently if it did not abuse the car so badly.
I would be afraid of transmission damage towing 2000 miles with that big trailer.
 
#19 ·
I tow a Wells Cargo SW10-VF which is a 5x10 V nose. I had it special built with a 5 ft high cabin.

As for brakes I would not consider pulling a trailer of this size without brakes with a car especially one as small as my 2012 3.6R Outback.

As for weight you will be surprised how quickly the weight adds up. Most of the time I am at about 2000-2200 lbs on my small trailer.

I have the OEM hitch which came with the trailer light adapter and wiring for a 4 way plug. I purchased a kit from E-trailer for the 7 way and the needed circuit breakers for the trailer brakes. I use a Prodigy P3 for my brake controller.

Here is my setup going through the Chandelier Tree in California.



Here is my OEM hitch and 7way.



With the low profile that my trailer has I have an overall average mpg of 21 after more than 18,000 miles of towing.

I did install a transmission cooler to help protect the 5EAT.
 
#20 ·
Also, find the proper way to the West Coast; if you max out your towing limits, avoid certain routes with steep hills (like avoid going West on your Rt2 a.k.a. Trans Canada Highway) but swing down to the US and take one of the interstates....you don't want to be stuck behind some of the slow moving RVs, especially in B.C. ...
 
#21 ·
Just watch the heat in the US vs the climbs as you head west the climbs get bigger and the temps seem to climb also. I've done enough trips in the old Subaru where we were running the heater full blast and slowing down to a crawl to get the heat spike under control before it hit temps that would result in a vehicle replacement. Plain and simple that sucks!!!! The 2010 and newer models are far far better on cooling and heat shedding but they still do not offer truck like cooling capacity for heavy load or draggy load with big head winds and or climbs in hot temps etc. The OB and the Legacy are the same machine if you wouldn't tow a big giant box across the country with a Legacy the OB isn't going to be any better given it weighs more and has more drag than the Legacy to start with. LOL Our prior car was a Legacy 5spd MT which we towed racing sailboats all over the west coast with that and attended Triatholon events packed to the max etc we beat the stuffing out of that car and it was just two of us. Now with 4 we take 3x's the stuff with us and it always works better when I take the light packing route and do everything to keep the weight down. If I can't keep the weight down I take our 07 Sequoia given when loaded it returns similar mileage to the overloaded OB except with far superior cooling system and power with no worries about cooking the car etc.

The shorter roof line box trailer is a good idea along with trying to stay in the 5ft wide trailer given those two steps do make a dramatic difference in the drag effect which is a big effect on the tow effort especially on a really long trip.
 
#22 ·
So, I wanted to give an update to everyone who shared their thoughts. Thanks. Yes, towing that large of a trailer is way over the top for the OB. We decided to simply and go with a 10' Rockwood popup tent trailer, yes it is more work to setup then we wanted but large and lots of amenities. Well, after the first trip towing that we realized even that is too heavy to realistically tow with 4 people in the car. The advertised tongue weight was 175lbs so I though we would be fine but after loading it up and getting it weighed it was over 280 lbs. Wow. It towed like crap. I was so disappointed.
But I love our OB so decided to get the lightest tent trailer I could find and bought a LivinLite Quicksilver 6.0 - this is literally half a trailer with just one queen bed and comes in at 650lbs dry and 75lb tongue weight. I figured this would do just fine for towing and we can make it work for camping. When totally loaded with battery etc the tongue weight still comes in at 175lbs. It tows pretty good. We put 4 bikes on the roof so there is a lot of drag and all in we lose about 25% in fuel efficiency but most of the time you don't even notice the trailer is there and you don't need trailer brakes.
We just came back from our first 10 day road trip and pretty happy with the setup although would rather move the bikes onto the trailer to reduce the drag once we figure out a way to do so.
So again, thanks everyone for your help and advice about towing.
 
#23 ·
Glad we were able to down size your plan ha ha!

Its pretty amazing how fast things add up when you start adding gear. My tent trailer is 900lbs empty but we have two queen beds on each side of the 4x6 floor. We did 4 decent sized trips this summer one trip we took the truck due to having to cross a 9000ft pass with 14% and 26% grades with 5 people. Even the 4.7L V8 was working hard. The OB would have been fine with two people and no trailer on that trip HA HA.
 
#24 ·
Boler trailer towed with 2006 Outback 2.5

Here is some real world towing experience with our 2006 2.5 litre Outback wagon. My wife and I are presently in Quebec having crossed Canada (We live on Quadra Island, near Vancouver Island) towing our 1972 Boler 1300 (13 feet total length) travel trailer. We were careful not to overload the trailer or car with heavy stuff; actual loaded trailer scaled weight is 1400 pounds. Mileage has averaged about 12 litres/100 km (23 miles/imperial gallon or 19/US gallon). But I cruise about 95-100 km/hr and take it easy on the steep hills. Speeds above this will really hurt mileage.

I have lots of towing experience having done over 200,000 miles in the past 6 years professionally delivering new RVs from the factory with a diesel pickup; 3/4 or one ton. The Outback is OK for towing this weight (i.e. 1,400 lbs.) but the 2,700 lb. tow capability suggested by Subaru is pretty optimistic, in my view. By taking it slow and gentle, we have handled some of the steepest mountain passes in Canada, in cool fall weather. We towed a rented tent trailer last fall that was actually heavier (about 1,700 lbs) and was noticeably harder to tow up steep grades.

One other point to make; weight is not the only consideration in towing. When you reach highway speeds, wind resistance becomes critical so a light-weight trailer with a tall boxy profile, may not tow as easily as a heavier but more aerodynamic unit with a lower profile.
 
#25 ·
I tow my boat about 1200lb with my 2014 6MT and its fine. A few weeks ago I rented a trailer, and they didn;t have the small one i wanted so they gave me a double axle model. Unloaded weight was 1800lbs, then I loaded it up and It was probably close if not over the 2700lb limit. Not enough power in the 2.5 to do this comfortably. Towing that load once in a blue moon wouldn;t bother me, but If I had to tow that regulary probably need another vehicle.
 
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