[DougNuts]

Hello all,

I'm looking to pick up an early - mid 2000's Outback once my current car sells. We have our first child on the way so I'd like to be sure I get a car with the latch system.

Do you know what year Subaru started putting the lower anchor points in the Outback? I can't seem to find this information when searching Google.

Thank you,
Doug

 

[smeric]

I know the 1st generation outbacks (1995-1999) didn't have LATCH, and the 3rd generation (2005-2009) do have them. Not sure about the 2nd gen. in between.
You can also check cars101.com for detailed specs by year.

 

[AWDFTW]

Subaru Outback research pages: all years/models

 

[subiesailor]

My 2001 Legacy had it. However you will find that parents with kids and lots of experience installing and swapping seats around tend to not use the Latch system rated for 60lbs by the way after the kid graduates from the snap and go. The reason being it is far far easier to use the ratchet setting on the seat belt to wrench the seat down tight vs fight with the individual latch straps. Pretty sure the 2000 and newer OB and Legacies have Latch for center position only!!! This is the case even for todays cars latch is to only be used for the center position.

I highly suggest you sign up for a childs seat install lesson from your local Fire Department or local police dept etc. I did it with the California High Way Patrol and learned a few things I would have never known. For instance if you fail to get the seat compressed down tight into the car seat the childs seat can actually be flipped onto its side in a hard impact accident. As demonstrated by a very large CA Highway patrol guy after one of the ladies in my group installed a demo seat in the back of a police car. He simply reached in and yanked the seat over on its side.

My wife actually is not capable of getting the seats installed tight even when she nearly climbs into the seat its self to compress it into the car seat while strapping it in.

Also you need to reinstall the seat every few weeks to make sure everything is still snug given things do loosen up as the seat in the car gets compressed etc.

 

[iainb]

Pretty sure the 2000 and newer OB and Legacies have Latch for center position only!!!

I can't speak for the Gen3, but Gen4 models have 3 LATCH points and the seat can be in any of the 3 positions.

http://techinfo.subaru.com/proxy/65379/pdf/ownerManual/065379_2012_Legacy/A2480BE-Aall_8.pdf - Page 1-32

 

[subiesailor]

I can't speak for the Gen3, but Gen4 models have 3 LATCH points and the seat can be in any of the 3 positions.

http://techinfo.subaru.com/proxy/65379/pdf/ownerManual/065379_2012_Legacy/A2480BE-Aall_8.pdf - Page 1-32

Ianb they all do - however you should never use latch in the outer position for several reasons. I recall this is also listed in your owners manual and in the child seat instructions.

From an accident point of view the reason you don't use the outer position with latch is that the top of the seat can shift outward where as the design of the actual seat belts in all cars is set up to reduce and prevent the movement outside of the door. Also a 60lb rated bracket is probably not what you want your child strapped to in a bad side impact accident.

All proper child seat installation backs this up by noting to never use Latch system for the outside seating positions. The other issue is the width between the inner bracket and the outer bracket is too wide to properly brace the car seat giving it more room to twist and rotate over on its side and being in the outer position rotating to the outside would be a very bad thing.

 

[iainb]

Ianb they all do - however you should never use latch in the outer position for several reasons. I recall this is also listed in your owners manual and in the child seat instructions.

From an accident point of view the reason you don't use the outer position with latch is that the top of the seat can shift outward where as the design of the actual seat belts in all cars is set up to reduce and prevent the movement outside of the door. Also a 60lb rated bracket is probably not what you want your child strapped to in a bad side impact accident.

All proper child seat installation backs this up by noting to never use Latch system for the outside seating positions. The other issue is the width between the inner bracket and the outer bracket is too wide to properly brace the car seat giving it more room to twist and rotate over on its side and being in the outer position rotating to the outside would be a very bad thing.

So let me get this straight- you (incorrectly) state, and obvious indignation, that the LATCH system only works in the middle position and when I show you that's incorrect you come back and say that you shouldn't use the outside seats anyway?



BTW - How do you propose transporting two children, both in car seats? They both can't be in the middle and there isn't a car on the market that can seat 4 seats in a row.

 

[subiesailor]

So let me get this straight- you (incorrectly) state, and obvious indignation, that the LATCH system only works in the middle position and when I show you that's incorrect you come back and say that you shouldn't use the outside seats anyway?

WTF?

BTW - How do you propose transporting two children, both in car seats? They both can't be in the middle and there isn't a car on the market that can seat 4 seats in a row.

Do you have kids? Sounds like you don't

Latch system can be used for many things not just kids car seats. Yes center spot is where you are allowed to use Latch system. All cars have these things called seat belts and since about 1995 most cars have a seat belt system that contains a ratchet system/setting designed for one major reason. It enables you to ratchet a kids car seat into place for a very tight fit. The outer seating position you ALWAYS use the seat belts! Even with Mercedes you use seat belts for the outer position.

I have two kids the oldest rides in a outer spot with the seat belt cranked crazy tight in ratchet mode holding the kids seat in place. Even if my child + seat was under the 60lb rating and I used the latch system I would never be able to get the seat anchored as tight as one can with the standard seatbelt. Given you simply have less leverage and pretty much zero space to pull the latch straps tight enough to match a nice strong pull on the seat belt.

As I SAID TAKE A child seat installation course! On of our good friends via my oldests Daycare is a Fireman he actually did a Seat inspection at the Daycare a while back with two of his co-workers 60% of the parents failed the inspection.

 

[fatabbot]

I can't speak for the Gen3, but Gen4 models have 3 LATCH points and the seat can be in any of the 3 positions.

http://techinfo.subaru.com/proxy/65379/pdf/ownerManual/065379_2012_Legacy/A2480BE-Aall_8.pdf - Page 1-32

That link confirms my memory. You have top tethers in the 3 positions, but bottom LATCH loops in only the two outside positions. Middle seat installation requires use of the seatbelt.

 

[iainb]

/sigh

You can read your manual (I even provided a link and page number) or continue arguing with incorrect information.

The tether anchorages (upper anchorages) are provided for all the seating positions (center and both window-side ones) of the rear seat.

I never made any claim to what is safest. I simply pointed out that you are incorrect in stating that Subaru doesn't provide LATCH for the side rear seats.

 

[fatabbot]

Page 1-27 even recommends against using the center position.....

http://techinfo.subaru.com/proxy/69512/pdf/ownerManual/069512_2010_Legacy/MSA5M1004A_9.pdf

Although I used the seat belt to secure my daughter's infant seat base in my OB. Never felt it was insecure in that position. Now, however, the kids' seats are in the outside position in our vehicles.

Bottom line, full LATCH in ONLY the two outside positions. :facepalm:

 

[subiesailor]

I never said that you did.

 

[subiesailor]

As I said the first post take a course!!! Mine was 30 minutes and a big eye opener.

By the way most first responders do not like the latch system however they support its use if it means better than average proper installation for kids under the weight limit with their seat. First responders actually prefer that seat belts used and the seats wrenched crazy tight given they see far better results from this type of set up. Not to mention its using a safety device designed to hold far far more weight than the latch system.

The snap and go base and some of the other bases due to their shape are far far easier to get installed and super tight using the latch set up than pretty much any of the standard car seats I've installed my own and afew for other parents or grand parents etc. Which is why the seat belt more often than not gives you a far far tighter fit.

Go take a course

And correction is yes the latch system is for the outer spots not the center sorry = as I said they are not ideal they are a compromise and I never use them. Given you have two straps you need to pull tight and they are always in a hard to reach tight spot which does not make it very easy to get tight. Vs seat belt you can wrench tight from the side of the seat and you only have one strap.

 

[DougNuts]

Thanks guys. I have done some research and it mostly jives with what you guys are telling me.

However, anchor points are typically not to be used in the middle position. Most cars are only set up to use the latch system in the side seats. There are cars out there that have the necessary spacing to allow the middle seat to use the anchor points though.

Here is a link to what I'm talking about: Using LATCH in Center Seating Positions - Car Seat.Org - Carseat, Vehicle & Child Passenger Safety Community Forums

 

[sjhortondesign]

I think that there is some confusions between top tethers and LATCH. Not all cars or SUV's have LATCH in all 3 across seating positions, and you need to read the manual for correct LATCH positions. In the pdf that iainb posted ONLY the outer (window seats) have LATCH. It reads "The lower anchorages (bars) are used for installing a child restraint system only on the rear seat window-side seating positions. For each window-side seating position, two lower anchorages are provided. Each lower anchorage is located behind the cover of seatback bottom." DougNuts You can properly install a seat using the using a shoulder or lap belt, LATCH is installed to make installation easier and to help with misuse.

 

[subiesailor]

I think that there is some confusions between top tethers and LATCH. Not all cars or SUV's have LATCH in all 3 across seating positions, and you need to read the manual for correct LATCH positions. In the pdf that iainb posted ONLY the outer (window seats) have LATCH. It reads "The lower anchorages (bars) are used for installing a child restraint system only on the rear seat window-side seating positions. For each window-side seating position, two lower anchorages are provided. Each lower anchorage is located behind the cover of seatback bottom." DougNuts You can properly install a seat using the using a shoulder or lap belt, LATCH is installed to make installation easier and to help with misuse.

Correct!

 

[pepperface]

regardless of all the anger... the peanut gallery is at agreement that the latch system for the outback is 2001 and up...

 

[iainb]

regardless of all the anger... the peanut gallery is at agreement that the latch system for the outback is 2001 and up...

I don't think anyone is angry...

 

[PammieSue]

Hello all,

I'm looking to pick up an early - mid 2000's Outback once my current car sells. We have our first child on the way so I'd like to be sure I get a car with the latch system.

Do you know what year Subaru started putting the lower anchor points in the Outback? I can't seem to find this information when searching Google.

Thank you,
Doug

 

[PammieSue]

I have a 2003 Outback and they have the teether anchors and ones in the headliner. They are great.