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Discussion Starter #1
After some long pondering, the Mrs. and I have decided that we are going to wait on the electric vehicle market and infrastructure to mature before we take the dive. There's some issues going on over at Tesla and other battery EV manufacturers and I really don't want to be stuck with a "public beta test"...

So, enter the Outback XT. I'm currently driving a leased 2019 Forester. It is good, but the cargo area is smaller than the Outback. It has more vertical space, but less depth. So items like beach chairs and such don't fit as well in the Forester. I guess if I was carrying tall items regularly, it would make sense.

I'm at the point where I've had some regrets going from my 2011 Outback Limited to my 2019 Foz Premium in terms of interior features and creature comforts. I'm planning on the Touring XT trim because I'd rather have features I might use from time to time rather than missing features I can't use.

The biggest obstacle at the moment is inventory and lease buyout. It appears that I have positive equity in the lease according to Carvana, and I could also add that positive equity with the months remaining on the lease that I don't have to pay (and could go into the longer-term Outback purchase)... it ends up being somewhere around a $7500 swing.

It looks like the 2021's are 1.9% for 48 and 2.49% for 60 or 72. As I care mostly about the month to month impact to my income, I'd probably go for 72 and just pay a little extra if I had extra money (overtime, any bonuses, etc.)

The outgoing models are at 0% as expected. I'd be curious when the 2021's will scale down to lower financing rates.

Does anyone expect anything major happening in the next year? I do have the flexibility of time to not have to buy this until the 2022 Model Year comes out. While this won't be a mid-cycle refresh, it could add some features or tech, or behind the scenes stuff like a stronger processor for the infotainment.

Even if they offered a hybrid or electric, I don't want to be the first one with it. I'd rather they perfect their version of the hybrid/electric and in ~10 years when this one starts getting a little tired (or I get tired of it), it puts me in a more acceptable position for a Hybrid Outback, if offered.

A good example is my 2019 Forester - it doesn't have lane centering, (has lane keep) but that was added outside of the normal mid-cycle and full-cycle refreshes. So, I'm curious if there's anything in other models that could potentially "roll into" Outback next year in between the minor refresh cycle which should be 2023. I've gone through some models in the US and some overseas markets and I can't really find anything specifically that jumps out. I know the JDM market typically offers more accessories.

Thanks, all!
 

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After some long pondering, the Mrs. and I have decided that we are going to wait on the electric vehicle market and infrastructure to mature before we take the dive. There's some issues going on over at Tesla and other battery EV manufacturers and I really don't want to be stuck with a "public beta test"...

So, enter the Outback XT. I'm currently driving a leased 2019 Forester. It is good, but the cargo area is smaller than the Outback. It has more vertical space, but less depth. So items like beach chairs and such don't fit as well in the Forester. I guess if I was carrying tall items regularly, it would make sense.

I'm at the point where I've had some regrets going from my 2011 Outback Limited to my 2019 Foz Premium in terms of interior features and creature comforts. I'm planning on the Touring XT trim because I'd rather have features I might use from time to time rather than missing features I can't use.

The biggest obstacle at the moment is inventory and lease buyout. It appears that I have positive equity in the lease according to Carvana, and I could also add that positive equity with the months remaining on the lease that I don't have to pay (and could go into the longer-term Outback purchase)... it ends up being somewhere around a $7500 swing.

It looks like the 2021's are 1.9% for 48 and 2.49% for 60 or 72. As I care mostly about the month to month impact to my income, I'd probably go for 72 and just pay a little extra if I had extra money (overtime, any bonuses, etc.)

The outgoing models are at 0% as expected. I'd be curious when the 2021's will scale down to lower financing rates.

Does anyone expect anything major happening in the next year? I do have the flexibility of time to not have to buy this until the 2022 Model Year comes out. While this won't be a mid-cycle refresh, it could add some features or tech, or behind the scenes stuff like a stronger processor for the infotainment.

Even if they offered a hybrid or electric, I don't want to be the first one with it. I'd rather they perfect their version of the hybrid/electric and in ~10 years when this one starts getting a little tired (or I get tired of it), it puts me in a more acceptable position for a Hybrid Outback, if offered.

A good example is my 2019 Forester - it doesn't have lane centering, (has lane keep) but that was added outside of the normal mid-cycle and full-cycle refreshes. So, I'm curious if there's anything in other models that could potentially "roll into" Outback next year in between the minor refresh cycle which should be 2023. I've gone through some models in the US and some overseas markets and I can't really find anything specifically that jumps out. I know the JDM market typically offers more accessories.

Thanks, all!
Where are you getting the financing terms for the 2021's? I don't see anything official but from what I read I thought it was 0.9% for 48 months and 1.9% for 60. I wouldn't expect those rates to decrease until at least early next year.
 

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2019 Subaru Forester Premium, Crystal Black Silica, Pkg 15
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Discussion Starter #3
These are located on the cars101 website which I’ve found to be pretty accurate. I know that Subaru typically has “higher” rates when a new model year rolls out, and then it decreases as the year goes on. It makes sense to push 0% or 0.9% for the leftover 2020’s so they can get rid of the inventory.
 

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'17 Outback Limited 3.6R in Venetian Red.
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This may not answer your question about the future models, but have you considered a used 2019 Subaru Outback? They are extremely reliable year cars, and would give you the space and comfort you need that your Forrest cannot provide.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
I have thought about that. It’s nice that a CPO one gets the extended Gold warranty. It’s also nice in terms of cost and reliable technology.

But, I do like the idea of being on the global platform and despite the drawbacks I do like the direct injection and tuning of the CVT.

I would be shopping between the 3.6R and the 2.4T, and it is very hard to locate a 3.6R coming off of lease around my area. I’d also be losing the Lane Centering feature.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Unfortunately the manual transmission is not compatible with the Eyesight system.
 

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'20 Outback Premium, '17 Golf
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My initial desire was to get an electric car this go around. Tesla was out as I work in healthcare and Tesla's are the trendy doc cars and few have good things to say about them. Range/Land Rovers were the thing a decade back until people got sick of expensive trucks that seemed to always have something wrong. Most rave about them initially then complain about the door handles not popping out or their garage door refusing to open/close or the car wont adjust anymore based on the driver. Lots of little software things that eventually drive them nuts. I looked into the Bolt and the AWD/&or Prius Prime but quickly realized I would need to shell out a few k to have a charger installed in our home. A home we plan on moving out of in the coming years.

If I were you I would keep my Forester another year and see what happens with the outback line. Who knows how you will feel in a year but if you are fine waiting I would wait. It's not like the cars will sell out or next years will be radically different.
 

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There's the wilderness edition coming:


A new generation of Eyesight with 360 degree camera is also coming soon.
technically it's enhanced radar and the use of GPS/traffic data for enhanced automated cruise control. No extra fancy cameras.

"Making its debut in the 2021 Subaru Levorg is EyeSight X. This new system builds
on EyeSight’s camera-based capabilities whilst adding 360-degree sensing through
all-around radars and sensors for increased autonomy. For instance, EyeSight X’s
automatic emergency braking now has Intersection Assist, which can detect
oncoming cars from the sides, along with Emergency Steering Assist, in which the
system can autonomously steer the car away from an impending collision if it
senses that there are no obstacles surrounding it.
EyeSight X’s greatest party trick is its enhanced full-speed adaptive cruise
control, which uses GPS data to enable completely hands-free driving in certain
situations. The system can fully operate during traffic jams, as well as have
the ability to slow down during corners and toll booths. EyeSight X can even
change lanes on its own."
 

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2019 Subaru Forester Premium, Crystal Black Silica, Pkg 15
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Discussion Starter #11 (Edited)
That’s interesting. Very Chevy SuperCruise like it Tesla Autopilot like. I wonder if it will get to the Outback in MY 2022 or do you think it is years away?

@SilverOnyx ; - Not sure the Wilderness appeals to me. I need a “City Slicker” edition that has like regenerative braking or a scissor lift that pops out from the bottom so I can park easier on the streets.

I don’t off-road so the utility is kind of wasted on me.

 

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I think the current Eyesight is fine, and the more sophistication they add may sound attractive but the devil is in the details. Some people already have issues with Eyesight (or is it stability control?) causing unusual (emergency braking?) when encountering a dip in the road or a sign near a sharp corner.

Knowing myself I would opt for the latest generation of Eyesight, however do expect that it may have even more false positives.

Many rushed to get the last of the 2019 H6 because they wanted the tried and true engine and not the risk of the new-ish 2.4T

I'm the early adopter type of person instead, but that comes with a price.
 

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That’s interesting. Very Chevy SuperCruise like it Tesla Autopilot like. I wonder if it will get to the Outback in MY 2022 or do you think it is years away?
would be lucky for it to show up in the 2023 refresh.... but who knows. It's some fancy radar units and other stuff, not sure how hard that would be to stuff into the mid model refresh.



Other stuff would be coming at some point... the levorg has an all digital dashboard now, no gauges with dials or lights. And still has the monster tablet infotainment.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Yeah, every so often I get a weird deceleration event on adaptive cruise. It only happens on adaptive cruise. I have never had a phantom braking event when I was in “driver mode” meaning I wasn’t using ACC.

Lane Centering is kind of what I want. I don’t need it to make decisions for me like Tesla’s Navigate on Autopilot does. I would probably like the true “hands free” Lane Centering like Chevy’s SuperCruise but there are ways around the Subaru system if you search for it. Personally I think the weight of the hand on the wheel should be enough and that’s what I hope to test.

I’m a little leery about DriverFocus. I’ve heard mixed things and I like how it ties into the Touring tech stuff, when it works. I would hate to have the annoyance of disabling it every time I start the car, but I plan on doing that anyway for auto start and hold mode.
 
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Can you remind us why you need a new vehicle? Staying with the one you have, assuming it's meeting your needs and not broken, is almost always the better choice.

I got rid of a perfectly healthy 2011 WRX because I wanted more ground clearance, more cargo capacity, Subaru Eyesight but still wanted some zoom-zoom so I jumped at the Onyx.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
It’s more of a longer term holding view. I leased my current Forester because I wasn’t sure I would like the form factor. It’s a capable car, and in all seriousness if I had purchased a Limited or Touring trim level this conversation wouldn’t be happening.

But, there are some creature comforts I miss going from my 2011 Outback Limited to the 2019 Forester Premium. The technology is great but it does not have Lane Centering.

The last 2 years we have been taking my wife’s SUV on weekend runs to visit family down by the shore in summer months. I much prefer driving my car, especially with the new technology and CarPlay, but it can’t fit our cargo as well. Coolers, duffle bag/luggage, beach chairs, bike racks, etc.

This kind of stuff would fit in the Outback cargo area without a problem.

So what we have been doing is almost using the SUV every single trip down the shore which is about 150 miles round trip. That adds up when you do that every weekend and sometimes multiple trips over the week depending on schedules.

Basically, I was happier with the OB form factor. I did want more zoom zoom coming from the 2.5i Limited I owned. The Forester didn’t have an option. So, this time, I am planning for said option.

It’s not one thing “wrong” with the Forester but a combination of everything.
 
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Lane Keep Assist(Lane Centering?) is the one feature i usually have turned off.

When it's switched on, i feel like i'm always fighting the car's steering wheel.

I do enjoy using it when i'm on a long highway drive/road trips, it helps break up my need to constantly focus.

Sometimes...i know not good to admit...i'll turn the lane keep assist on and adaptive cruise on the freeway when i need to check my phone and would normally cause a dangerous loss of attention situation. I really appreciate the feature in these circumstances.

Another issue i have is that when my wife is in the car, she really dislikes the feeling of the car bouncing slightly back and forth within the lane. I almost always will not turn on the feature when she's in the car.
 

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Why not lease a 2020/2021 Outback if you're not sure if you want to wait?
 

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Discussion Starter #19
@Frank828 ; I believe the ping pong sensation you are describing is lane keep assist. That waits until you are projected to exit a lane before it corrects.

Lane Centering is more active and a different system and proactively keeps you centered.
 
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Then for sure Lane Centering is the thing i personally dislike. I dont like how it is constantly creating feedback on the steering wheel while driving.
 
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