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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Will these be the answer for Subie users who want a plug and play LED headlight and DRL?? The description and and review I watched sounds really promising!

 

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Nice, I've been waiting for someone to design a true dual-output bulb replacement. I recall looking a prior generation 2-strokes but support for a true DRL mode was vague.

Not to nitpick, but since this error seems to be spreading, it's DRL, not DLR. ;)
 

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I would want to see a beam pattern for those lights in the housing you are going to use.
 

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I would want to see a beam pattern for those lights in the housing you are going to use.
So long as the output in DRL mode is appropriate, and they do at least as well as the stock bulbs overall (I'm betting yes on both counts), I don't believe that matters because we're talking about high beam bulbs here - older Gen 5s use the high beams as DRLs, and the only alternative modification is disabling them completely and installing LED switchbacks.
 

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LED rarely put out low lumen even at 6 to 9V. They are claiming 30% of 2600 at sub 6V, This is still a whopping 86X lumins, enough peeve people off in front of you

Peak Lumens:
2,600lm @ 25C
LED Chips:
Osram Oslon Black Flat S (KW HKL531.TE)
PCB Width:
<2mm (including LEDs)
Kelvin:
5500K (pure white)
DRL Trigger:<6V
DRL Intensity:
30% (780lm)


all the information I can find indicates that Subaru runs DRL at 50% and that is greater than 6V so that makes that functionality useless
 

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LOL, missed the first try, so you aggressively change your attack... and you wonder why some folks find you abrasive. A more tactful choice of words and you'd come off far more pleasant.

LED rarely put out low lumen even at 6 to 9V.
That's an odd statement. Rarely? I'm not an EE, but it sounds like they're using a dual-mode constant-current driver. A very sophisticated and reliable way to control LED output. Good drivers these days can operate on a wide range of input voltages while outputting exactly the required forward voltage at a very stable, regulated current. Feeding it the correct voltage and controlling output by regulating current is probably the best way to keep the emitter(s) happy and maximize life span. This is a premium product after all.

They are claiming 30% of 2600 at sub 6V, This is still a whopping 86X lumins, enough peeve people off in front of you
Huh, math much? They're referring to the drive current being cut by 30%, which does not necessarily have a linear relationship with output. Read the spec - they say 460 lm, and that's likely an IS measurement (not OTF, meaning it'll actually be a good bit lower installed). Sounds about right to me. And why wouldn't it be? They can configure this sort of driver circuit however they like. 30% is not some arbitrary value they were stuck with.

all the information I can find indicates that Subaru runs DRL at 50% and that is greater than 6V so that makes that functionality useless
??? DRL mode is triggered at 6-9V, per their specifications. I would, obviously, confirm voltage in the DRL circuit before ordering. But it should otherwise work - no concerns with PWM since everything I've read suggests its a standard resistor.
 

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If you want to stop pissing people off, keep the color temp below 5500K. I've experimented with 5500 and 4500K HIDs. I can run the 4500s at heights i could never get away with on 5500s. Having 1 side slightly higher, (passenger), lessens the shock of both HID beams hitting the oncoming cars at the same time. Gives the pupil a split second more time to adjust.
 

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HIR bulbs are a fantastic upgrade. I've done then with my high beams and fog lights. What is HIR??
 
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@stevenva Interesting, hadn't heard of HIR. I've got stock Subaru HIDs, with aftermarket 4800K Philips capsules, and they're beautiful. I'd never go higher and I'm definitely not a fan of LED headlights in general, it seems like many manufacturers (even on some relatively upscale vehicles) are using cheap emitters that have excessive blue tint (beyond what would even be expected at the rated CCT, which is not unusual with low-end phosphor technology).

The only reason those of us with older Gen 5s are interested in LEDs is to do away with the dated yellow DRL look we got stuck with. Unfortunately there's no quality incandescent bulb that runs white under reduced voltage. And they even put LEDs in my headlight assembly! I guess we're supposed to think it took them a few years before they could figure out how to make those LEDs (aka, the "c-light") sufficiently bright for DRL use. Yeah right. More likely a deliberate move by Subaru to encourage upgrading to a later model Gen 5.
 

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Side note on LEDs as daytime running lights. For an LED to be dimmer, PWM pulse width modulation which rapidly turns on/off is used. Not voltage reduction. Voltage reduction into LEDs causes flicker.
 

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Side note on LEDs as daytime running lights. For an LED to be dimmer, PWM pulse width modulation which rapidly turns on/off is used. Not voltage reduction. Voltage reduction into LEDs causes flicker.
Actually, that's not quite correct, PWM is just one method of dimming an LED (but, yes, I've seen that on some cars - looks very bad, IMO).
See my post above - I suspect Morimoto is using a constant-current driver. A good-quality CC driver generates absolutely zero flicker. Like I said, I'm no EE, but I am a veteran of candlepowerforums. You can find some serious light-quality obsession over there. ;)
 

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For an LED to be dimmer, PWM pulse width modulation which rapidly turns on/off is used.
Either PWM or linear current (not voltage) reduction can be used to dim LEDs. LED brightness is current dependent, not voltage dependent. PWM is generally more power efficient than linear control, but it has problems of its own.

Voltage reduction into LEDs causes flicker.
Not as long as the applied voltage remains above the LED's forward voltage threshold.

N.B. I've been designing with LEDs since the early 1970s. Back then there was no choice but to design your own driver circuitry, too ... over and over again.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Nice, I've been waiting for someone to design a true dual-output bulb replacement. I recall looking a prior generation 2-strokes but support for a true DRL mode was vague.

Not to nitpick, but since this error seems to be spreading, it's DRL, not DLR. ;)
I knew that, but apparently my brain didn't tell my fingers :ROFLMAO:
 

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LOL, missed the first try, so you aggressively change your attack... and you wonder why some folks find you abrasive. A more tactful choice of words and you'd come off far more pleasant.



That's an odd statement. Rarely? I'm not an EE, but it sounds like they're using a dual-mode constant-current driver. A very sophisticated and reliable way to control LED output. Good drivers these days can operate on a wide range of input voltages while outputting exactly the required forward voltage at a very stable, regulated current. Feeding it the correct voltage and controlling output by regulating current is probably the best way to keep the emitter(s) happy and maximize life span. This is a premium product after all.



Huh, math much? They're referring to the drive current being cut by 30%, which does not necessarily have a linear relationship with output. Read the spec - they say 460 lm, and that's likely an IS measurement (not OTF, meaning it'll actually be a good bit lower installed). Sounds about right to me. And why wouldn't it be? They can configure this sort of driver circuit however they like. 30% is not some arbitrary value they were stuck with.



??? DRL mode is triggered at 6-9V, per their specifications. I would, obviously, confirm voltage in the DRL circuit before ordering. But it should otherwise work - no concerns with PWM since everything I've read suggests its a standard resistor.
uh I provided stright from their website what the DRL trigger voltage is and it clearly states DRL trigger <6V

uh math much? really come on now read what they said:

DRL Drive: The LED Driver is configured to accept a wide range of input voltage, making them compatible with low voltage daytime running lights commonly found on modern vehicles. When the LED driver detects 6-9V of input: The system logic automatically switches to produce just 30% of the standard output. The low power drive rate of 250mA produces only 460lm per emitter and enables the 2Stroke 3.0 to produce a suitably low output volume as a daytime running light. In this mode, the cooling fan also shuts off to conserve power/lifespan. For vehicles with a PWM-based DRL signal, an inline PWM module that produces a clean DC6V will be required. The driver is completely potted, making it completely weather-proof. Note that the DRL-Drive function is only for use in non-US markets.

I correctly calculated what 30% of output was (again per their specs list in my first post and statement above) peak of 2600 lumins and 30% of rated output is roughly 800 (sorry I meant to type 76X) lumins but if you must be exact it is 780 which is what they stated. that is enough to annoy people in front of you..particularly when used in reflector high beam housings like this generation of Subaru Outback.

and then you missed this one on their site

DOT/SAE/FVMSS108:
NO (NOT STREET LEGAL IN HEADLIGHTS IN USA)
 

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uh I provided stright from their website what the DRL trigger voltage is and it clearly states DRL trigger <6V
OMG, read carefully, you've just quoted this!
"When the LED driver detects 6-9V of input: The system logic automatically switches to produce just 30% of the standard output..."

...but if you must be exact it is 780 which is what they stated. that is enough to annoy people in front of you..particularly when used in reflector high beam housings like this generation of Subaru Outback.
Oh boy. Once again (are you feeling ok?). You're not even bothering to read what you've just quoted:
"The low power drive rate of 250mA produces only 460lm"

That's a far cry from 800. So, it's nice you have an opinion on the matter, but what evidence do you have that this output would be unsafe for a DRL? Your speculation has no value to me. Besides, like I said in my second post, I would obviously expect a safe, "appropriate" output, and these guys are competent engineers from what I've heard.

and then you missed this one on their site

DOT/SAE/FVMSS108:
NO (NOT STREET LEGAL IN HEADLIGHTS IN USA)
No, I did not, nor would I ever use LED units in halogen LOW BEAM HEADLIGHTS. Do you really think it would be a challenge to judge the safety of a daytime running light with your own eyes? Sounds trivial to me. Sorry, but you haven't made your case here.
 
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