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2004 Toyota Sienna, miss my eyesight. Life moves on.
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If this was true they would run the oil through a cooler!
Cooling

  • Contrary to common belief, antifreeze is not responsible for the entire car's cooling mechanism; the antifreeze in your radiator cools only the upper portion of the engine. Friction in the engine's moving parts creates heat. Motor oil is responsible for cooling the friction that is created in the car's lower portions, including the crankshaft, timing gears, pistons, rod bearings and camshaft, according to the Motor Oil Evaluator website. Without motor oil's cooling capability, the engine will be susceptible to frequent overheating.


Read more: What Is the Purpose of Motor Oil? | eHow.com What Is the Purpose of Motor Oil? | eHow.com
 

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2016 Carbide Gray Limited with Moonroof, Nav, and Eyesight
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Cooling is true, but having enough oil to maintain pressure to provide the cushion between moving parts is crucial. Some engines (no Subaru's that I know of) did not have quick enough drain-back to the pan, and could leave the pan nearly empty and the oil foaming from air pulled into the pump. Oil can help cool, think piston squirters and valve spring bathing, but also needs to be kept cool to maintain its viscosity. The danger in the op's case is scuffed bearings from loss of oil pressure, since he shut down so quickly overheating was not apparent.
 

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14 ob limited
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Anything that lubricates helps reduce heat, by lowing the resistance/friction between the parts. If you would run one of these engines and pull the drain plug the lights will not come on until it has less than 2 to 2.5 qts if oil in it! Once this happens the bearings have sustained damage, the question is how much damage. Being the oil was just changes the damage will be less than on which has the plug fall out after hundreds of miles!

The main reason for oil in engines if for lubrication, which helps reduce heat!

Run an engine with a plugged up radiator and see how long it takes to destroy the engine compared to a plugged up oil cooler!
 

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2012 3.6 Limited Ruby Red w/Nav
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A friend of mine had an '88 Accord that he didn't change the oil in for 3 years. When it was changed, the mechanic told him it was 3 quarts low... But it only has a capacity of 3.7 quarts!! Long story short, the car was still running with no issues 100k miles later when he sold it... and he beat the ever loving shi!t out of that thing.

I think it'll be fine, though I would try and squeeze a gold extended warranty out of the deal just for a little more peace of mind.
 

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2004 Toyota Sienna, miss my eyesight. Life moves on.
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Anything that lubricates helps reduce heat, by lowing the resistance/friction between the parts. If you would run one of these engines and pull the drain plug the lights will not come on until it has less than 2 to 2.5 qts if oil in it! Once this happens the bearings have sustained damage, the question is how much damage. Being the oil was just changes the damage will be less than on which has the plug fall out after hundreds of miles!

The main reason for oil in engines if for lubrication, which helps reduce heat!

Run an engine with a plugged up radiator and see how long it takes to destroy the engine compared to a plugged up oil cooler!
I never said cooling was the only purpose of oil but its a HUGE component of it. Its not the only reason diesels hold so much more oil than a gas motor but cooling is a factor in why diesels hold so much oil. Its a piece of the puzzle is all.
 

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Cayman holds 12qts if I recall correctly. It has a service interval of 12,000 miles on the oil.

The amount of oil a car carries plays into what it is used for - what the engine does to the oil and service intervals. Diesels pack more oil for many reasons one of which is they introduce more material to the oil which needs to keep this stuff suspended the less oil you have the less material the oil can keep suspended. That is the major reason diesel engines generally run larger volumes of oil.

The Cayman runs 12qts because its a sports car and depends heavily on the cooling aspect of the oil with the rear engine set up.

As Fox put it cooling is simply one part of the more complex story about how oil and oil volume is figured for cars.
 

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14 ob limited
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I never said cooling was the only purpose of oil but its a HUGE component of it. Its not the only reason diesels hold so much more oil than a gas motor but cooling is a factor in why diesels hold so much oil. Its a piece of the puzzle is all.
Diesel's hold so much more oil because the burning of Diesel creates more particulates, also diesel engines filters have a smaller micron filtration for removing these contaminates, and having more oil volume allows for it to take longer to become contaminated.
 

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06 OBW 2.5, 05 Forester, had 03 H6 OBW
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My H6 has an oil cooler- the '05 ****** probably does too!

Oil spray (directed) is critical in cooling the pistons.

The volume of oil must be enough to account for what is circulating through the engine (and unavailable to the pickup) AND be sufficient that its temp can be lowered while it is cooling in the pan.
 

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Tungsten 2017 2.5 Limited w Eyesight SOLD!
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The 3.6 OB has a water cooled oil cooler. It is located right at where the oil filter screws in. The 3.6 also takes 7 qt's of oil.
Oil is an integral part of the cooling system of any engine and not just for lubrication only. This is why using the right viscosity and oil type is important. Many cars with "water" cooling still have large oil capacity's. Most Porches, bigger engined MB's and BMW's have 12 qts of oil capacity just to help cool the motor.
 

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He didn't run the engine without oil, when he pulled over oil was still pissing out of the engine. If oil is coming out of the engine it had to be in there to begin with.
So he knows for a fact it was running out the oil pan and wasn't residual from being sprayed all over the undercarrage? Also if the oil plug was missing there is no way any oil would have been left over like the shop says. So was the plug missing or not?
 

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Ok, got my car back....before I go on...will back answer some questions...

Yes, I shut the car down when I pulled over. Engine off.
I went back today but couldn't tell if the oil trail was mine...possibly ... the trail was a long way....of some black stuff...but the trail stopped at an intersection...so not sure if it was mine. Looked for the drain plug...nada unfortunately. The oil patch has been cleaned...pretty well...almost couldn't find it.

Anyways...here's my final story...they didn't call me but I decided to pop in to see what's up....they wanted to keep the car for another day to further test.....so talking to the manager, they checked the engine codes and everything came clean. They drained the oil after putting in new one to check for any shavings or what ever. they test drove it as well and see there was any difference...after doing the other checking first. they didn't take the engine apart as they claim they didn't need do as the other checks passed. All in all they couldn't find any problem with the engine and said. I could take the car back if I like and drive it and see if any problems would occur and contact them back.
If they claim that they drained the old oil it's a lie. If like you say the oil plug was missing then there would have been no oil to drain by the time they got the car. Do not stop persuing this, they are feeding you a line and trying to avoid replacing the engine. No "code" is going to show that the engine was damaged by running it low on oil.
 

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'03 Outback H6-3.0 Black Granite Pearl, base model with cold weather package and cloth seats.
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If they claim that they drained the old oil it's a lie. If like you say the oil plug was missing then there would have been no oil to drain by the time they got the car. Do not stop persuing this, they are feeding you a line and trying to avoid replacing the engine. No "code" is going to show that the engine was damaged by running it low on oil.
You gotta read it a little closer:

"..... They drained the oil after putting in new one to check for any shavings or what ever......"
 

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You gotta read it a little closer:

"..... They drained the oil after putting in new one to check for any shavings or what ever......"
Ok. You are right, fair enough. I stand corrected. Still he is only asking for trouble if he stops pursuing this. Whoever changed the oil made a major screw up and I promise you damage was done. Shops love to take advantage of customers that are ignorant about thier cars. It's a shame that this takes place and its being done in this case, no question. I urge the person that ownes this car to do a little research, get second and third opinoins. Take legal action if required. Knowing what he knows now the best thing to have done would have to never shut the engine off and let it fail completely, then there would have been no question.
 

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'14 3.6R Outback
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Ok. You are right, fair enough. I stand corrected. Still he is only asking for trouble if he stops pursuing this. Whoever changed the oil made a major screw up and I promise you damage was done. Shops love to take advantage of customers that are ignorant about thier cars. It's a shame that this takes place and its being done in this case, no question. I urge the person that ownes this car to do a little research, get second and third opinoins. Take legal action if required. Knowing what he knows now the best thing to have done would have to never shut the engine off and let it fail completely, then there would have been no question.
Well that's just silly. If he did not do what he could to minimise the damage then he could be on the hook for the repair. Have you never heard of "Duty to Mitigate." Even if your morals don't prevent you from doing that the law does.

I'm not saying the shop doing anything shady or not.

But you sir do not know what you are talking about. You can not promise there was damage. I can not promise there was no damage.
 

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2012 OUTBACK 2.5 LIMITED SILVER ICE Metallic, moon and nav free
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Well that's just silly. If he did not do what he could to minimise the damage then he could be on the hook for the repair. Have you never heard of "Duty to Mitigate." Even if your morals don't prevent you from doing that the law does.

I'm not saying the shop doing anything shady or not.

But you sir do not know what you are talking about. You can not promise there was damage. I can not promise there was no damage.


How would you ever know? He pulled over as soon as he saw the light. He could have gone 100 yards or 1000 miles. He did what he did when he did it. IT IS NOT HIS FAULT the oil drain plug came out.
 

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OP, any updates??
 

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Well that's just silly. If he did not do what he could to minimise the damage then he could be on the hook for the repair. Have you never heard of "Duty to Mitigate." Even if your morals don't prevent you from doing that the law does.

I'm not saying the shop doing anything shady or not.

But you sir do not know what you are talking about. You can not promise there was damage. I can not promise there was no damage.
I've been working on cars for 40 years. There was damage done, you sir are wrong. Case closed.
 

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Sorry to add in to this conversation at the end, but I had to offer some points to consider. I'm a fluid power specialist, so I know a thing or two about oil... ;)

The oil is used to
1. Lubricate
2. Cool
3. Provide reserve capacity
4. Displace air when allowed to settle sufficiently
5. Provide a method of transporting contaminants away
(plus a few others I won't bother with)
So many posts here have been accurate, but missing the big picture. A cooler is only necessary if the loads imposed are greater than the heat rejection capability of system (includes reservoir/oil pan, filter, engine itself, and so on). High loads require drastic measures. The automatic transmission & towing is evident of this.

The biggest point to make in this gentleman's unfortunate (or fortunate!) circumstance:
The oil pressure light did not come on. Had it come on, it means there was insufficient oil pressure after the pump to lubricate the bearings/ECT. With a loss of oil from the oil plug (the lowest point on the 'reservoir'), as long as the oil still could be picked up by the pump and not cavitate (lack of oil to the pump's inlet), the light would remain on and all 'should' be fine.

Of course one can never be certain in these circumstances, but I give great credit to the driver for having the right sense to pull over as quickly as he did and stop the engine. He saved the engine, and his car.

I think all cars should have low oil LEVEL sensors to give ample warning to let the driver pull over (but that's just me). To heck with the TPMS I say.
 

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And to add to my previous post: I always do my own oil changes. The biggest reason: I can see if there are any other issues that need attention. Sometimes a shop, or even the dealer, doesn't see everything.

I have NEVER taken my cars to a shop for an oil change.

On my new 2013 I plan to do a complete change of fluids at 5000 km. Reason: the gearbox & rear Dif do not have filters, and any contaminants continue to move around imbedding themselves into bearings, gears, and so on. It doesn't matter how small they are: if they are present, they are doing damage, however minute.

My next task is to see if my CVT uses an oil cooler and, if so, install a spinner.
Spinner II Centrifugal Oil Filters

Trust me, they work in the hydraulics industry, but aren't very common.
 
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