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Discussion Starter #1
Hi,

Had my plugs changed @ 60K miles in 2014 at a dealer in San Antonio, and they did not change out cylinder 5 & 6.

I know this know, as 2010 outback started running rough on my way home from FL, so I stopped at the Tampa Subaru dealer.

Tampa dealer said cylinder 5 was miss-firing, so I asked them to change all the plugs since it now has 120K miles.

Tampa dealer told me #5 & 6 spark plugs where original, and never changed. They left the plugs with me; and wrote it down on the work order. Total cost was around $450, plus that enterprise rental junkets for $120 for 3 days. All in, this cost $580+ a 3 day delay in Tampa while they fixed me car.

What do I do? I have the original receipt from 2014; and am preparing to call the dealer on Monday, but thought I'd ask advice.

Dave
 

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seems like they had a mechanic work on it in the morning. changed 4 plugs, then left and another mechanic came in and did not finish the last 2.


or someone just had that 4th lunch time beer and forgot the car had 2 more plugs.

what san antonio dealer was this? (seeing as how you put it in the dealer review section).

...I guess you could call the subaru of america 800 line and ask them what the first dealer "should" do with your expenses.

_______

I notice you have a BMW motorcycle. but do not list your 2010 H6?

hit the link in my signature next to the ?, and fill out the "my car" section.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Thanks Eagleeye.
I was thinking of calling the manager of the dealer service first, before calling Subaru.

I'll post an update on what happens and who the dealer is once they reply.

So I assume I should expect both the plug change and rental car cost covered? What about the hotel?

Dave
 

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car rental and hotel might be covered under your automobile insurance policy. (might,.. I know I ditched the car rental part last year as I had not used it since about 2002).

I would think they are going to weazel out of the bills as much as they can, ...maybe 100% if you don't threaten to sue with a nasty lawyer letter.

this is a weird case, and it would be like the owner of the place would have to say "pay it". I mean sounds like a great newspaper story for bad press for them.

couple years back here we had a guy with a 2001 H6 that a dealer had done head gaskets to and it boomeranged as engine was not a good canidate, and they kind of half did the job. ...dealer caved in and got a used engine for it after much discussion on this board about them.

I think this is it: like 400 posts now, place was in Wisconsin where subarus are big sellers and this big dealer had more then one location:
http://www.subaruoutback.org/forums/66-problems-maintenance/158018-well-they-fixed-my-hg-s-but-killed-rest.html
 

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car rental and hotel might be covered under your automobile insurance policy. (might,.. I know I ditched the car rental part last year as I had not used it since about 2002).

I would think they are going to weazel out of the bills as much as they can, ...maybe 100% if you don't threaten to sue with a nasty lawyer letter.

this is a weird case, and it would be like the owner of the place would have to say "pay it". I mean sounds like a great newspaper story for bad press for them.

couple years back here we had a guy with a 2001 H6 that a dealer had done head gaskets to and it boomeranged as engine was not a good canidate, and they kind of half did the job. ...dealer caved in and got a used engine for it after much discussion on this board about them.

I think this is it: like 400 posts now, place was in Wisconsin where subarus are big sellers and this big dealer had more then one location:
http://www.subaruoutback.org/forums/66-problems-maintenance/158018-well-they-fixed-my-hg-s-but-killed-rest.html
Daaaaang. That might be one of the largest dealers in the entire state, they sponsor one of the biggest Subaru car shows too.
 

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Thanks Eagleeye.
I was thinking of calling the manager of the dealer service first, before calling Subaru.

I'll post an update on what happens and who the dealer is once they reply.

So I assume I should expect both the plug change and rental car cost covered? What about the hotel?

Dave
Sorry to hear about your experience. It's a bummer to take an otherwise OK car to an "authorized" repair facilty and have them screw it up. Been there done that.

I would call Subaru in any case. This is the kind of incident they are supposed to want to hear about. You're very fortunate that you've got evidence in the form of the 2nd dealer's write up and the 2 original plugs.

I would think that you could be compensated by whatever the trip interruption cost you (car rental, hotel, meals, etc.) plus a refund of the original cost of the plug change since it was not done correctly. Plus if they are serious about this some kind of coupon for future service or purchase of goods.

Funny IIRC on some Toyotas the plug changes are difficult and expensive and they compensated by installing iridium plugs with 120k mile life. But Subaru does not do this even on the H-6! Just asked the other day what the dealer wants to change plugs on our 2.5 and was quoted $299, for parts and 2 hours labor. Give me a break please. Not that hard to change the plugs on the H-4.

I have acquaintances who are former service writers and dealer techs and we've chatted about these things. A major flaw in the repair system at the dealer is that there is questionable quality control. It's fixed if the tech hands a piece of paper to the writer, who can then give it to the cashier. It's deemed too expensive to have a qualified person running around whose job is to check that the work was actually done. If that were true, your car would not have left the shop with only 4 plugs changed. The customer gets to be the test pilot and can find out what errors were made later, maybe much later or maybe never. The tech who didn't do the work correctly has long since moved on to some other shop Ford or Honda or whatever where he can make $1 more per hour.
 

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My advice would be to suck it up and move on. $600 is not worth the aggravation of going back to the dealer over something they may or may not have done 3 years and 60k miles ago.
 

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This is a perfect example of why I have performed as much of my own automotive maintenance and repair work as I possibly can since the late 1970s. That said, I do not look forward to changing the spark plugs in our 2013 3.6R when the time eventually comes. I have monster-sized hands, and this task will be a real challenge for me. I am glad that our 3.6R came with a factory set of iridium plugs - I have never had a set of them needing replacement before 130,000 to 150,000 miles. At just over 38,000 miles on this vehicle, I have years ahead of me before I have to tackle that job.
 

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Daaaaang. That might be one of the largest dealers in the entire state, they sponsor one of the biggest Subaru car shows too.
...yeah and whoever was in charge of saying "lets do head gaskets on that particular abused turd original engine",..
.vs getting a good used USDM or JDM for it needs to be sent off to a chrysler dealer,

...the foot dragging on their part is really sad.

it was @botenredwolf s car. (I kind of recall when he bought it, there were champion plugs on one side, and older NGKs on the other).

edit: and its kind of nice to ask any mechanic for the old parts just to be left in the car for the owner to toss out,
...so in this case the 6 old plugs are there to look at,...and not just 4.
 

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...yeah and whoever was in charge of saying "lets do head gaskets on that particular abused turd original engine",..
.vs getting a good used USDM or JDM for it needs to be sent off to a chrysler dealer,

...the foot dragging on their part is really sad.

it was @botenredwolf s car. (I kind of recall when he bought it, there were champion plugs on one side, and older NGKs on the other).
lol let's not even start on that one. don't jinx me, been 50k+ perfect miles outside of my weird overheating issue over the summer
 

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This is a perfect example of why I have performed as much of my own automotive maintenance and repair work as I possibly can since the late 1970s. That said, I do not look forward to changing the spark plugs in our 2013 3.6R when the time eventually comes. I have monster-sized hands, and this task will be a real challenge for me. I am glad that our 3.6R came with a factory set of iridium plugs - I have never had a set of them needing replacement before 130,000 to 150,000 miles. At just over 38,000 miles on this vehicle, I have years ahead of me before I have to tackle that job.
I will need further schooling on the gradations of iridium plugs. I just checked the part #'s for the plugs in all 2012-2013 Outbacks and they all use "iridium" plugs, and the maintenance schedules all call for 60K replacement. I was going by the warranty book for my 2012, for 2013 I could not find a warranty book online so I looked on cars101.com: 2013 Subaru maintenance schedule and new car break-in period.

The owners manual for my old Toyota V-6 said it uses iridium plugs, replace every 120K. So it would seem there are some "iridium" plugs that are good for 120 K, and others that are good for 60K, at least in the case of the NGK iridium plugs recommended by Subaru.
 

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So it would seem there are some "iridium" plugs that are good for 120 K, and others that are good for 60K, at least in the case of the NGK iridium plugs recommended by Subaru.
Subarus are hard on plugs, they ping alot. 60K miles used to be the recommendation for the turbos. I think as the timing and throttle maps have gotten more complex, especially because people want to run 87 (cheap gas) longevity is going to suffer.

BTW, subarus, at least mine were built with Denso plugs. For my years Denso is the 1st recommend, then NGK. Nobody ever mentions Denso.
 

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Subarus are hard on plugs, they ping alot. 60K miles used to be the recommendation for the turbos. I think as the timing and throttle maps have gotten more complex, especially because people want to run 87 (cheap gas) longevity is going to suffer.

BTW, subarus, at least mine were built with Denso plugs. For my years Denso is the 1st recommend, then NGK. Nobody ever mentions Denso.
you have hotter tunings running in your own turbos. ...racing plugs of any brand, and shorter plug life is normal,

vs. a H6 from texas.

_______

I am glad few people report old plugs and new plugs mixed together on this board.
 

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My advice would be to suck it up and move on. $600 is not worth the aggravation of going back to the dealer over something they may or may not have done 3 years and 60k miles ago.
Well I kind of see your point, don't dwell on the past and so forth. However, it's not a question of what may or may not have happened, the OP has proof that the first dealer did the job wrong, and the OP incurred financial loss because of the incorrect work.

Plus, If I were the Subaru organization, I'd want to know that franchisees, who are using my name to make a very good living, are screwing around with my customers and my reputation.

So I'll refine my suggestion to the OP to first call SOA, fully describe the incident, and his supporting evidence, then give them something to work on such as he'd like compensation for the money he's lost for the trip interruption and the faulty first repair (or whatever the OP thinks is appropriate). Then let SOA go forward with the solution from there.
 

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I have run Denso and NGK iridium plugs in various vehicles for at least the past 15 years. Never had an issue with either brand and as I said previously, never had a set last less than 130,000 miles. The four vehicles in question were/are a 2000 Lexus RX300 SUV (Denso), a 2004 Lexus RX330 SUV (Denso), a 2005 Jaguar S-Type sedan (NGK), and a 2006 Jaguar XK8 convertible (NGK). I sold the two Lexus SUVs in 2007 and 2012 respectively. We still own both Jaguars, and they continue to function perfectly with their factory iridium plugs at 105,000 miles and 114,000 miles respectively.
 

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Subarus are hard on plugs, they ping alot. 60K miles used to be the recommendation for the turbos. I think as the timing and throttle maps have gotten more complex, especially because people want to run 87 (cheap gas) longevity is going to suffer.

BTW, subarus, at least mine were built with Denso plugs. For my years Denso is the 1st recommend, then NGK. Nobody ever mentions Denso.
I was going by the electrical system specs I found in the owners manuals for 2012 and 2013 Outbacks on subaru.com; all plugs are NGK, and when I cut and paste the part#'s into Amazon they are all described as iridium plugs. And, the Subaru factory recommendation is to change every 60K.
 

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I would mention it to the dealership. But it would be more of a discussion along the lines that they have lost your confidence, and that you want to be assured that future work will be done correctly, and that you want to be assured that they make things right if they ever are done wrong.

As far as financial reimbursement, it seems that all you are out would be the expense of a rental car. You state that with 120k miles on the car, it was due for new plugs anyway. So you would have been getting new plugs soon, but most likely at your convenience.

If you push for reimbursement of expenses that are related to recommended maintenance (the 120 k mile spark plug change), you are going to be seen as a gold digger, and probably won't get anything. But if you only ask for expenses related to your inconvenience because of their error, then that may be seen as fair, and you may be reimbursed.

If you keep good records, find the receipt for when the 60k spark plug service was done. Point out that they charged you for parts and labor for spark plugs on a 6 cylinder, but you only got the work of a 4 cylinder. In all fairness, they should also reimburse you for the difference between what those two services cost at the time it was done.
 

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the OP has proof that the first dealer did the job wrong,
The OP "says" he has proof. 3 years, 60k miles later there will be a whole lotta finger pointing. 600 bucks isn't worth the aggravation.
 
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