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How do you REALLY feel about the Start/Stop System?

  • It is great, I love it!

    Votes: 86 13.1%
  • I don't care, indifferent.

    Votes: 124 18.9%
  • I don't like it but I can live with it.

    Votes: 158 24.1%
  • I hate it, I wish I could disable it permanently.

    Votes: 287 43.8%

  • Total voters
    655
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SubaruOutback.org Founder
2018 Outbacks, Grey Premium & Silver Limited
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Possibly being clever to save the cost of a push button. Engineers aren’t always practical. When we first started using color type touch screen HMIs (Human Machine Interface), some engineers felt “obligated” to use every color available on a simple screen. It’s still a standing joke amongst us old timers that grew up with analog meters, rheostats, relays, switches, etc.😆
And don’t get me started on bearings and oil. I have seen too many real life and extremely costly examples of premature bearing failures on electric motors because of frequent motor start stops. I am talking about motors with 6” or greater diameter bearing journals riding babbitt bearings. But the same can be inferred to nearly any bearing where the lubricant is “squeezed out” in the stopped mode.
Frankly I am not convinced that any automaker cares about the likelihood of an auto start/stop system contributing to lower reliability in the future. I am of the opinion that the industry and consumers are treating newer vehicles more and more like objects to simply dispose of when it becomes convenient. If your vehicle does not last as long and/or there is something that has aggravated you about it during your possession of said vehicle, you are more likely to replace it sooner.

There are many variable factors that add up which contribute to the likelihood of vehicle replacement more frequently for many consumers. Think me a wacky conspiracy theorist (that is fine by me) but I see things like this as a devil's bargain for the consumer.
 

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2020 Touring XT
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211 Posts
So, shame on me, I pulled out Fuse 33 (to save wear & tear on the defrost and side mirror wiring) in the main engine compartment, set the defrost to always on, and simply use the defrost switch to disable the auto on off starting function.

It would make sense if the side mirror heaters were on the same fuse as the rear window defroster, but they are not. It is a separate fuse. And you can't pull that one unless you want to also disable your windshield washer pump. In the warmer weather I use the front manual defrost or the AC function which includes the windshield vents to defeat Auto SS. It's a little simpler because it's sticky/latched whereas the rear defrost is per trip.
 

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2020 Subaru Outback
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17 Posts
It would make sense If the side mirror heaters were on the same fuse as the rear window defroster, but they are not. It is a separate fuse. And you can't pull that one unless you want to also disable your windshield washer pump. In the warmer weather I use the front manual defrost or the AC function which includes the windshield vents to defeat Auto SS. It's a little simpler because it's sticky/latched whereas the rear defrost is per trip.
You are indeed quite correct. I was misinformed about the R.DEF fuse also handling the mirror defrost. Your suggestions to defeat the Auto SS are also very much appreciated. PS: Please forgive me if I would rather change the abbreviation from Auto SS to ASS😆
 

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5,329 Posts
Frankly I am not convinced that any automaker cares about the likelihood of an auto start/stop system contributing to lower reliability in the future. I am of the opinion that the industry and consumers are treating newer vehicles more and more like objects to simply dispose of when it becomes convenient. If your vehicle does not last as long and/or there is something that has aggravated you about it during your possession of said vehicle, you are more likely to replace it sooner.

There are many variable factors that add up which contribute to the likelihood of vehicle replacement more frequently for many consumers. Think me a wacky conspiracy theorist (that is fine by me) but I see things like this as a devil's bargain for the consumer.
When it comes to daily drivers, I'm one of those consumers that resembles this post. Doesn't matter how long I've owned it, if anything about it aggravates me or the warranty is up, time to replace it.

Life is too short to drive around in an annoying car.
 

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2020 Outback Onyx Edition (black)
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11 Posts
I used it occasionally at first, but eventually found it too annoying. It's three taps on the screen to turn it off; I've gotten pretty good at automatically doing that as part of my start-the-car routine.
 

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2016 Outback 2.5 Limited, Ice Silver and 2020 Outback Limited XT Cinnamon Brown
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102 Posts
I would be okay with it if it served some useful purpose or saved a significant amount of fuel. And if it was less noticeable.

As it is it does not and it is very noticeable. And it has to increase wear and tear on the engine.

Also it can be scary if you forget about it and try to make a quick left turn and find the steering wheel isn't moving right away because of no power steering. There really should be a way to turn it off and have it stay off until a person chooses to turn it back on.
 

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It would make sense if the side mirror heaters were on the same fuse as the rear window defroster, but they are not. It is a separate fuse. And you can't pull that one unless you want to also disable your windshield washer pump. In the warmer weather I use the front manual defrost or the AC function which includes the windshield vents to defeat Auto SS. It's a little simpler because it's sticky/latched whereas the rear defrost is per trip.
That's why you pull the mirror heater relay not the fuse.

484569
 

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20 Outback Limited XT 13 Outback 3.6R Limited
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I would be okay with it if it served some useful purpose or saved a significant amount of fuel. And if it was less noticeable.

As it is it does not and it is very noticeable. And it has to increase wear and tear on the engine.

Also it can be scary if you forget about it and try to make a quick left turn and find the steering wheel isn't moving right away because of no power steering. There really should be a way to turn it off and have it stay off until a person chooses to turn it back on.
The power steering is electric, so continues to work even when ASS stops the engine. If you are planning to make a turn after coming to a stop, slightly turn the wheel as you stop and the ASS will not engage.
 

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I seldom notice the auto stop/start, but I decided to fool around with the fuse #33 method used to disable the auto/stop start. I set the defog option to continuous and pulled the fuse. The one touch rear defrost button on the dash disables the stop/start without heating up the rear window defrost element. It does look like the outside mirrors are still powered up for heat with the disabled button depressed on the dash. A specific relay is mentioned for the mirror heat, but I am not really up to speed on this. Would it be possible for a member to fill me in on this and also state any possible negatives related to pulling the heated mirror relay. Thank to all for the interesting ideas found here....
 

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2020 Subaru Outback
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I seldom notice the auto stop/start, but I decided to fool around with the fuse #33 method used to disable the auto/stop start. I set the defog option to continuous and pulled the fuse. The one touch rear defrost button on the dash disables the stop/start without heating up the rear window defrost element. It does look like the outside mirrors are still powered up for heat with the disabled button depressed on the dash. A specific relay is mentioned for the mirror heat, but I am not really up to speed on this. Would it be possible for a member to fill me in on this and also state any possible negatives related to pulling the heated mirror relay. Thank to all for the interesting ideas found here....
Interesting observation. I was told that the rear defog also worked the side mirror defog. I assumed F33 would power both. I learned later that isn’t the case.
Perhaps the best method would be a compromise of pulling F33 (or the R.DEF relay itself and the side window mirror defog relay. If you look up a couple posts, SilverOnyx was gracious enough to post the fuse/relay diagrams. The relay you would be looking for is in the box on the passenger side of the engine compartment. I assume the relay name is MIRROR HEATER RELAY, but can’t say for certain. However that’s where I would start.
I do want to give a very special thanks to all of those that contributed to this topic, their help was absolutely invaluable. On the downside, my first idea of replacing the R DEF relay with a TIme Delay Off After Energization electronic/relay got a tad more complex. Now I would have to use 2 relays. FWIW, I was going down the path of a 10 or so minute “ON” period that would time out and go to an open position even though the relay electronics remained energized. I figured some extra time on the rear defog circuit would be livable with during the summer months. During winter, I might either increase the time delay or turn the R Def off then immediately back on again for extra defrost time.
I haven’t thrown in the towel yet though. I have the summer to tinker.
 

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I haven’t thrown in the towel yet though. I have the summer to tinker.
Not being an electronics anything except consumer - here are my thoughts:

We know that the stop/start defeat when pressing the defroster isn't simply a matter of power draw telling the system to deactivate - because when we cut the draw the button still works. The question is - how does the system know that we pressed the button? Could it be as simple as the system detecting the button's LED being on?
 

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I am inclined to believe that if it were easy to disable or simply turn off more frequently, that the environmentalist regulators would somehow penalize Subaru on their emissions ratings which is what Subaru wants to avoid and thus why they forced the usage of this system in the first place.
Yeah. I am sure there is the answer. (y)
 

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Not being an electronics anything except consumer - here are my thoughts:

We know that the stop/start defeat when pressing the defroster isn't simply a matter of power draw telling the system to deactivate - because when we cut the draw the button still works. The question is - how does the system know that we pressed the button? Could it be as simple as the system detecting the button's LED being on?
The button is wired to the ecu. Or whatever you want to call theain computer. And that ecu then controls the relays. So the ecu has full control over those things, and Subaru could reprogram everything.
 

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I have a 2020 Subaru Outback Touring XT and I hate the "Auto Start/Stop" programming that I can't permanently turn off. It takes a number of steps just to get the car ready to drive. And all for what??? It does not save gas. It does not hurt the engine or starter. It may or may not run down the battery. All so that Subaru can claim a higher gas mileage numbers and trick buyers who believe the stickers on the windows in the dealer showroom.

The government mileage tests are being "hacked" by Subaru (and others) as the testing period is approximately half run time and half idle time. So the more the engine can be off the better the "mileage" even though the resultant buyers will never see the savings in their driving. Subaru wins, their customers do not.

So until Subaru gets responsive and gives the owner an option to make the "default" for Start/Stop = OFF do this:

- Go into Settings/Car/Defogger and set the timing to "Permanent" or "On" . . . whatever it says in your car such that it does not go off after, say, 15 minutes, etc. You only need to do this once.

- Then, each time you start your car Turn On the Rear Defogger and you're done.


Not a permanent fix but just one fast push of a button vs. 4,5,or 6 steps with the flaky screen buttons to turn it off the way Subaru wants. Apparently the programming is such that if there is an extra drain on the battery the engine will not do the Auto Stop/Start nonsense. And the software running the new Outbacks and Foresters is a brand new version just developed for 2020 so let's hope it gets fixed soon (and while they're at it, maybe turn off the "Lawyers" screen at the car's start as well after say 10 times from the day it is sold. Then give the option for a "new owner reset" that clears out all options when you sell it or trade it in and then the Lawyer's Screen comes back for 10 times again, just like you can reset your cellphone, etc???).

The above also works using the front defroster but that gets noisy and hot and isn't as good. It might also work if you're hooking up a trailer but I haven't tried this yet. But likely this should work too.

That's it until Subaru makes this change for its customer's rather than selfishly holding onto their sales and marketing tricks. Several other (European apparently) brands have trusted their customers to use this option . . . let's go Subaru?
 
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