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2007 Outback 2.5I non Turbo
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Discussion Starter #1
Ok so I just did both front and rear struts on my 07 OB (used 04 rear struts) and it now rides way better. However I had to take a 2x4 and sledge hammer to two of my wheel to get them lose from the rotor.:confused: I there anything I can do to stop this from happening? Had I been on the side of the road I would have been screwed.
 

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2004 Outback Wagon, 2.5, 4EAT, All weather package.
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I think it has more to do with rust buildup causing the hub of the wheel to seize onto the hub of the rotor. I would take a wire brush and cleanup the rust on the mating surfaces as well as around the lugs/holes. It may not be a bad idea to spray a little bit of WD40 just on the mating surfaces to try to eliminate or prevent rust buildup in the future, however, DO NOT get WD40 on the threads of the lugs or on the lug nuts. This will cause you to overtighten and overtorque the lugnuts significantly when you remount the wheel, potentially causing problems such as stripping the lugs, breaking the lug nuts, and in a worse case scenario, a wheel-off causing loss of control of the vehicle.
 

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2010 2.5i Outback, 2015 2.5i Legacy w/Eyesight
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I there anything I can do to stop this from happening? Had I been on the side of the road I would have been screwed.
If you are on the road with a flat tire where the rim is stuck to the rotor, take the spare tire and bounce it against the side of the tire you are trying to get off. It works wonders--just like a sledge + 2"x4".

I used this trick when switching to my snow rims/tires this past season since all four wheels were stuck on quite well from a longer rotation interval.
 

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If you are on the road with a flat tire where the rim is stuck to the rotor, take the spare tire and bounce it against the side of the tire you are trying to get off. It works wonders--just like a sledge + 2"x4".

I used this trick when switching to my snow rims/tires this past season since all four wheels were stuck on quite well from a longer rotation interval.
You can also put the lug nuts on just snug, still a little loose and rock the car back and forth. It should break the wheels free.
 

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OBW H6 VDC, Tribeca, XT6
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unfortunately it's fairly common. breaking the rust free (wire brush or something) and covering the surface in antiseize will help it from coming back too.

nice suggestions guys!
 

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2007 Outback XT Ltd
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unfortunately it's fairly common. breaking the rust free (wire brush or something) and covering the surface in antiseize will help it from coming back too.

nice suggestions guys!
I agree that anti-seize is the answer. WD 40 is NOT.

Tire techs hate anti-seize because it gets all over their gloves and the tire balance machines. Screw them.

Use the silver stuff (aluminum blend), add a light layer to the entire steel mating surface of the rotor, then take a paper towel and wipe off the excess so that there is just a fine even film. You definitely don't want a lot of compound that will just sling out and make a mess of the surrounding parts.

Renew the film every rotation to cover bare spots - you can usually just wipe what remains around with a towel. You can also coat the hub nut and surrounding area and it will prevent further rusting. When done to a brand new car, those nuts will stay virgin for many years.

Do this and you will NEVER have rusted hubs, rotors or stuck wheels. I've been using this technique for 30+ years with never a problem except for a few dirty looks from the tire store guys.....

John Davies
Spokane WA USA
 

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2004 Outback Wagon, 2.5, 4EAT, All weather package.
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I agree that anti-seize is the answer. WD 40 is NOT.

Tire techs hate anti-seize because it gets all over their gloves and the tire balance machines. Screw them.

Use the silver stuff (aluminum blend), add a light layer to the entire steel mating surface of the rotor, then take a paper towel and wipe off the excess so that there is just a fine even film. You definitely don't want a lot of compound that will just sling out and make a mess of the surrounding parts.

Renew the film every rotation to cover bare spots - you can usually just wipe what remains around with a towel. You can also coat the hub nut and surrounding area and it will prevent further rusting. When done to a brand new car, those nuts will stay virgin for many years.

Do this and you will NEVER have rusted hubs, rotors or stuck wheels. I've been using this technique for 30+ years with never a problem except for a few dirty looks from the tire store guys.....

John Davies
Spokane WA USA
Anti-seize will work, but WD40 will work very well also. WD40 by design repels water to prevent rust buildup, as well as helps dissolve rust. If you want a simple, cheap solution, it will work just fine.

I should also add it is not necessarily a good idea to get anti-seize on the lug studs either. Again, you are lubricating the threads and therefore risk overtightening the lugs significantly. Overtightening causes the studs to stretch and weaken, leading to the potential of snapped lug studs, and worse case scenario, the possible wheel-off situation and loss of control of the vehicle.
 

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2011 2.5i Steel Silver Metallic, Limited , Moonroof
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If you are on the road with a flat tire where the rim is stuck to the rotor, take the spare tire and bounce it against the side of the tire you are trying to get off. It works wonders--just like a sledge + 2"x4".

I used this trick when switching to my snow rims/tires this past season since all four wheels were stuck on quite well from a longer rotation interval.

+1 for that. That is my favorite trick, been using it for years.The spare tire as a tool is great, its heavy, can't damage the rim or tire, and always in your car. I find that it works great to jack the wheel I need to take off, lay down behind or in front of the car and put tire under car,then pick up tire slightly and slam it into the back of the seized wheel. Usually knocks it right off in 1-3 swings.

I also have used the anti-seize on the hub trick to great results over the years. I am always careful to leave a bit of space around the lugs as I believe that a bit of metal to metal contact helps the wheel sung down and stay on.
 

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2010 2.5i Outback, 2015 2.5i Legacy w/Eyesight
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I find that it works great to jack the wheel I need to take off, lay down behind or in front of the car and put tire under car,then pick up tire slightly and slam it into the back of the seized wheel. Usually knocks it right off in 1-3 swings.
I find your description troublesome, so I hope I am misunderstanding. You are recommending to jack the car up on the included jack and then lay down underneath it while bashing on the wheel you wish you remove?

I would not recommend this method as it is dangerous and could leave you dead instead of with just a flat tire if you destabilize the car and it falls on you. What I do is:
1. Jack the car up near the tire you wish to remove.
2. Remove all bolts except one (leave that last bolt on there just enough to keep the wheel from flying off when it becomes unstuck).
3. Standing in front of the stuck wheel, stand the tire up vertically where it would roll straight into the wheel you wish to remove.
4. Pick up the spare tire and swing it to hit (tire against tire) the left and/or right sides of the tire (one side per swing) attached to the rim you wish to remove.
5. Change to spare as usual.

Obviously, swing too hard and your car might take a tumble. But if you're stranded, you might save a sore toe/heel from kicking and kicking comes with the same risk.
 

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If you're changing wheels for the season, when pulling into the garage or driveway come to a short stop and that also helps break up any tension between the wheel and hub.

And while actually swapping wheels, a wire brush, some paper towels and a small tube of antiseize go a long way. Brush off any existing rust, wipe down the wheel hub and apply a SMALL amount of antiseize and spread it around the hub (like others mentioned above, avoid getting it in the lug holes). Repeat this every time you switch wheels and they'll come off in a pinch.
 

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I thinking lubing the wheel studs is a very low concern. The running torque of lugnuts I put on is in the few ft lbs range at most. When you are torque to 76 ft lbs, what's a few extra ft lbs? It's within the measurement accuracry of your torque wrench. You know, the one you use to put that spare on out in the snow by the side of the road when you change a flat?
 

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2004 Outback Wagon, 2.5, 4EAT, All weather package.
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I thinking lubing the wheel studs is a very low concern. The running torque of lugnuts I put on is in the few ft lbs range at most. When you are torque to 76 ft lbs, what's a few extra ft lbs? It's within the measurement accuracry of your torque wrench. You know, the one you use to put that spare on out in the snow by the side of the road when you change a flat?
It is more than a "few". We're talking a possible difference of 50 or more footpounds. Certainly enough to ruin the stud and risk breaking them. You aren't putting as much torque on the lug nut to get it to tighten the same number of threads. So you tighten it further, stretch the stud, and risk breaking it. This is the same reason why you don't use an impact wrench to install wheels.
 

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I don't lube my wheel studs, and have never seen anti-seize on them, and I liberally cover the mating surface on mine with anti-seize, and I'm a slob.

By the way, if using cast rims and chasing a balancing-type vibration, check for very strong black corrosion on the wheels mating surface. On mine it caused enough runout to cause a vibe at speed, and I had to chip it off with a hammer and blunt punch, it laughed at my wire wheel, but it shattered like glass.
 

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Got empirical evidence? This has been standard practice for decades. Adding lube to a fastener will not double the torque. It reduces the torque required to turn the threaded portion. Most stud applications call for lube, generally an oil. Some fastener manufacturers even sell their own brand of lube for this purpose. What a lube will due is increase the applied torque. Your torque wrench will not waste as much effort in just turning the fastener.

See this link, it has good info.

James

It is more than a "few". We're talking a possible difference of 50 or more footpounds. Certainly enough to ruin the stud and risk breaking them. You aren't putting as much torque on the lug nut to get it to tighten the same number of threads. So you tighten it further, stretch the stud, and risk breaking it. This is the same reason why you don't use an impact wrench to install wheels.
 

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Your torque wrench measures the amount of pressure you are putting on it to tighten the nut. Because it requires less effort to tighten the lug nut, your torque wrench gives a false reading it will read much lower than it actually is, resulting in you OVER tightening the nut, although you have "torqued it to specs".

Source: Been through ATS training through TIA (Tire Industry Association), certified as a tire tech, also certified Goodyear Tire Expert, and I work in tires every day.
 

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I have been a mechanic for a decade. I understand perfectly well how a torque wrench works. Read what I posted up. Torque wrenches, indeed, read the rotational torque applied to the fastener. The torque spec is a clamp load spec.

The less friction used in rotational torque, the more accurate the applied torque. This is why high torque load applications typically use studs, rather than bolts. Instead of turning a long bolt that twists and has a lenghty thread, a much shorter nut can be turned. The bottom end of your GM uses studs for the rods. They may not have an especially high torque applied to them, but they are subjected to dynamic loads, much like a wheel end is.
 

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Torque is nothing but a way of guessing at the measure of the clamping force.

The nut tightens with less effort. The less effort required the less measured torque, the more you have to turn the wrench to measure the proper torque. Torque measure is not a perfect measure. That's why there are torque ranges and you should double check and triple check everything.
 

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I use the NAPA store brand of silver anti-seize (8 ounce can). The back label specifically states that it does NOT affect bolt torque. I have used it on every conceivable type of fastener for decades with no issues. Including wheel studs (threads only, not the cone seats). I always recheck the lug nut torque after 50 or 100 miles and rarely find that the nuts have moved, even a tiny amount.

I can't comment if this applies to only this product, or to all brands.

Interesting thread here: ... Use of Anti Seize on Vehicle Lug Nuts

John Davies
Spokane WA USA.
 

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As I've used a number of aftermarket wheels (winter tire packages from TireRack that often include fitment rings), the possibility of a cold weld (intermetallic formation) between aluminum and iron is a big problem. After it happened to me, I wire brushed the hubs and mating surfaces to a nice polish, and applied anti-seize. I refresh it with every rotation.
 
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