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2020 Onyx
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If they give me a refurb, they will absolutely have a lawsuit on their hands.
How will you determine if the new part is really new or a refurb? Asking because there are many who have gotten replacement CCU's and it would be interesting for them to discover if their replacements were new or reman, and it would help us to discover if the reman units are the replacements that are failing.
 
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2020 Touring XT Crystal Black Silica
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289 Posts
Discussion Starter · #102 ·
How will you determine if the new part is really new or a refurb? Asking because there are many who have gotten replacement CCU's and it would be interesting for them to discover if their replacements were new or reman, and it would help us to discover if the reman units are the replacements that are failing.
They are required by law to identify any used, rebuilt or reconditioned part on the work order. And I'll definitely be asking.
 

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2020 Onyx
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Is this law applicable in all 50 states or does it depend on jurisdiction?
 
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2020 Touring XT Crystal Black Silica
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Discussion Starter · #106 ·
Is this law applicable in all 50 states or does it depend on jurisdiction?
It's an unfair and deceptive trade practice under federal regulations published by the Federal Trade Commission.
See 16 CFR Part 20,
§ 20.1 Deception generally.
(a) It is unfair or deceptive to represent, directly or by implication, that any industry product is new or unused when such is not the fact, or to misrepresent the current condition, or extent of previous use, reconstruction, or repair of any industry product.

Some states have similar laws on the books.
 

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Yeah. I wrote my own Lemon Law letter back on May 21 (I am a lawyer but SoA doesn't know that). That was what prompted SoA to offer to replace the CCU and give me the 10 year/100,000 mile Gold Plus zero deductible warranty. And the vacuum. :LOL: They obviously want to avoid buying these things back but I think they will have to buy them back in droves if they can't get the head unit issue resolved.
Wow.

Did they actually give you that top drawer extended warranty? What would one of those things set you back?
 

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2020 Onyx
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10,336 Posts
I looked it up on the Cornell website - for those interested:


The Guides in this part apply to the manufacture, sale, distribution, marketing and advertising (including advertising in electronic format, such as on the Internet) of parts that are not new, and assemblies containing such parts, that were designed for use in automobiles, trucks, motorcycles, tractors, or similar self-propelled vehicles, regardless of whether such parts or assemblies have been cleaned, repaired, reconstructed, or reworked in any other way (industry product or product). Industry products include, but are not limited to, airbags, alternators and generators, anti-lock brake systems, brake cylinders, carburetors, catalytic converters, differentials, engines, fuel injectors, hybrid drive systems and hybrid batteries, navigation and audio systems, power steering pumps, power window motors, rack and pinion units, starters, steering gears, superchargers and turbochargers, tires, transmissions and transaxles, and water pumps.
 

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2020 Touring XT Crystal Black Silica
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289 Posts
Discussion Starter · #109 ·
Wow.

Did they actually give you that top drawer extended warranty? What would one of those things set you back?
Well, so far I don't have the paperwork in my hands, but that's what SoA said they were doing. The cost? I don't know. I've seen different numbers. Best estimate $1500-2000.
 

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20 Outback Premium; former 19 Outback Premium, 85 GL Wagon, 87 GL-10 Wagon
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As an aside, my 7 year old 6S+ running 14.6 is running fine using CarPlay on our 20 Premium. However, on our current long trip I discovered the phone overheats and shuts down CarPlay after about two hours if placed in the forward cubby by the USB ports face up; when I insert it face down, it goes at least 3 hours before overheating. My theory is the case insulates the back, so the back side needs more exposure to ambient air for cooling. Under normal use the phone is fine, but it seems CarPlay works it hard which eventually makes it overheat. When I take it out of the cubby it’s physically warm/hot to the touch.

So if your CarPlay is disconnecting and reconnecting, look at your phone for the cause. If your entire head unit is rebooting as many have reported in this thread, that’s a whole separate issue that I fortunately do not have, at least not on a regular basis.

I have noticed a variation in boot times of the head unit after starting. Most of the time no issues, but maybe 10-20% of the time it takes a little longer but then runs fine. The first big update fixed the equalizer issue and brought full screen CarPlay, the second brought SS to the front, so hopefully the rumored next update will finally bring more consistent operation to everyone.
 

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2020 Onyx XT
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65 Posts
Android Auto still won't work after GPS errors (the head unit thinks that it is 1024 weeks in the future). Head unit freezing up, rebooting, or stays black until I turn off and restart the engine, etc. The worst thing lately have been GPS errors with positioning, for example, tell me that my current location is more than 20 miles from my actual location. No help from SOA customer support, Grant has not been very sympathetic to my issues and cannot provide updates because not enough people have reported the problem.

Exploring lemon law options now, such a headache. Been a Subaru fan all my life, this is likely the last time I will consider any Subaru.

8/2019 Outback Onyx XT, 19,000 miles
 

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20 Outback Premium; former 19 Outback Premium, 85 GL Wagon, 87 GL-10 Wagon
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@nevermas sorry to hear, hopefully you’ll work out a solution with SOA without having to go through lemon law channels. SOA has been very supportive of many members here including me with past issues.

I know I was very frustrated when a dealer bricked the head unit in my 20, but since unbricking it myself it’s been doing great. It certainly seems a mystery why some have issues yet most are trouble free. If it truly was systemic you’d think nearly everyone would have problems. Best of luck resolving yours one way or another.
 

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All
I have an 2020 Limited - has the 380 software update via the recall.
I'm usually by myself, so not able to record/document crashes.
I have about 8k miles currently. About 6100 miles, I started to have reboots about every 200 miles or so.
I usually have the map screen (until last Saturday had the Nov 20 map update) being displayed. I usually am using the Radio on XM or FM radio for music/news. I very rarely have my Android phone connected, if I do it is just charging as I will turn off all the Android Auto functions prior to starting to drive. I have the Navigation window on most of the time to see the traffic and also to reduce screen burning a constant image.
When I have a reboot the music/noise will stop, I will then look to see, and note a black screen, then followed by a reboot sequence. Usually, the system will restart and return to the operational status prior to crash/reboot. When I have been actually using the Navigation with a route, the route returns and picks back up. Sometimes the safety systems seem to fail as well, but once the system reboots all is well.
The other day my radio upon starting the car choose a random FM radio station, that I do not have saved as a favorite and have not selected to listen to previously.
The reboots are occurring more frequently, I did make a trip to my local Subaru dealer service dept. and was told by my assigned service advisor, "...there is another customer having similar problems and SoA is aware." This service advisor told me,"... that SoA is working on a fix to be released in June/July and to check back in a few weeks."
I had not previously posted the information about the "fix" out of respect, that I may have been told privileged information, but since it has been posted, I can confirm this information.
I love my car, but it is very frustrating for the reboot problem.
I bought this car used, missing the factory manuals, I finally got some factory manuals it took every bit of 2 months as they were missing, so I have had a learning curve, but I have found this car, fairly intuitive and gaps filled in here by the various members.
I hope SoA, can figure these problems out soon. My computer experience tells me they should at least release a debugging patch that is easily installed via the wifi update program in the car, and make it very small to facilitate this install.
Too bad SoA does not monitor the public unofficial forums, they could learn quickly problems the customers are reporting and solving. From my experience Dodge (here in the US) monitors message bases and even has accounts to interact with owners on the message bases, and does so frequently.
On the converse side, it is possible that SoA does monitor forums, and just "listens" and will not admit to the practice.
Seems to be, an easy way to collect marketing data, and a way to be proactive in problem management.

I hope, as others have noted, that a solution is found soon, as my car is going to age out vs. mileage on the warranty then I guess we, the unlucky few are just plain stuck.

Silver-Blue
Yes, we all seem to be having this problem. I have a 2020 Limited with 11,000 miles. I get 3-5 reboots a month. Sometimes the computer is very slow to boot up the first time and just drags. I can be 2 miles from my house when the radio finally comes on. Once I was sitting at an intersection waiting to turn left using the automatic vehicle hold and it rebooted, releasing the brake and sounding an alarm and telling me that I needed to put my foot on the brake pedal immediately.

I really do love this car. I hope Subaru can get this resolved without too much of a hassle. In all the years I’ve been driving and owning cars this one is my favorite!
513767
63DBF502-B3F6-4A85-8593-68FFA6C24E59.jpeg
 

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2020 Onyx
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10,336 Posts
I'm not having that problem, so it's not affecting everyone. If it were affecting everyone it would be more likely a software problem (like when everyone was losing equalizer settings). I was wondering if people with the Harman Kardon system were having more frequent reboots but it seems other Onyx (non HK) users have reboots as well.

I wonder if having Navigation makes it more likely? I don't have Nav in mine.

Then you have reports of this bizarre 2040 date problem.
 

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2020 Outback Limited XT, Abyss Blue Pearl (Mine) PP 2 , 2017 Ice Silver Outback Limited (Wife's)
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177 Posts
My experience has been very different from the recent posts. I have the latest software update and have had maybe 3 reboots in the year and a half that I've had my car. They have been so random that there is no way for me to figure out any kind of pattern. For reference, I have a Limited with Nav but don't plug my phone in so no ACP or AA. I use a flash drive for my music. In my world the infotainment system works fine.
 

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All
I have an 2020 Limited - has the 380 software update via the recall.
I'm usually by myself, so not able to record/document crashes.
I have about 8k miles currently. About 6100 miles, I started to have reboots about every 200 miles or so.
I usually have the map screen (until last Saturday had the Nov 20 map update) being displayed. I usually am using the Radio on XM or FM radio for music/news. I very rarely have my Android phone connected, if I do it is just charging as I will turn off all the Android Auto functions prior to starting to drive. I have the Navigation window on most of the time to see the traffic and also to reduce screen burning a constant image.
When I have a reboot the music/noise will stop, I will then look to see, and note a black screen, then followed by a reboot sequence. Usually, the system will restart and return to the operational status prior to crash/reboot. When I have been actually using the Navigation with a route, the route returns and picks back up. Sometimes the safety systems seem to fail as well, but once the system reboots all is well.
The other day my radio upon starting the car choose a random FM radio station, that I do not have saved as a favorite and have not selected to listen to previously.
The reboots are occurring more frequently, I did make a trip to my local Subaru dealer service dept. and was told by my assigned service advisor, "...there is another customer having similar problems and SoA is aware." This service advisor told me,"... that SoA is working on a fix to be released in June/July and to check back in a few weeks."
I had not previously posted the information about the "fix" out of respect, that I may have been told privileged information, but since it has been posted, I can confirm this information.
I love my car, but it is very frustrating for the reboot problem.
I bought this car used, missing the factory manuals, I finally got some factory manuals it took every bit of 2 months as they were missing, so I have had a learning curve, but I have found this car, fairly intuitive and gaps filled in here by the various members.
I hope SoA, can figure these problems out soon. My computer experience tells me they should at least release a debugging patch that is easily installed via the wifi update program in the car, and make it very small to facilitate this install.
Too bad SoA does not monitor the public unofficial forums, they could learn quickly problems the customers are reporting and solving. From my experience Dodge (here in the US) monitors message bases and even has accounts to interact with owners on the message bases, and does so frequently.
On the converse side, it is possible that SoA does monitor forums, and just "listens" and will not admit to the practice.
Seems to be, an easy way to collect marketing data, and a way to be proactive in problem management.

I hope, as others have noted, that a solution is found soon, as my car is going to age out vs. mileage on the warranty then I guess we, the unlucky few are just plain stuck.

Silver-Blue
I've also had the head unit crash on me and then reboot after a minute or two. Last night the whole unit shut down and actually turned off. I'll be calling today to see what the service depart has to say.
 

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2021 Outback Touring XT
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I'm not having that problem, so it's not affecting everyone. If it were affecting everyone it would be more likely a software problem (like when everyone was losing equalizer settings).
I have to disagree. The chances that there is a large batch of bad chips that made it through QC at the original chip manufacturer, then again when it was assembled into this head unit, and that they’ve been being randomly used over the past 2 years seems highly unlikely.

What seems more likely is that there is a software bug only triggered by certain actions which some people do and some don’t. Or perhaps firmware was written for an original chipset which was changed on the fly due to supply constraints and the firmware was thought to be fully compatible with the new chipset but it actually isn’t.

I would be willing to bet a very large sum of money that in a month or so another software update will be released that addresses this issue.
 

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2020 Limted XT Black/Ivory
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I have to disagree. The chances that there is a large batch of bad chips that made it through QC at the original chip manufacturer, then again when it was assembled into this head unit, and that they’ve been being randomly used over the past 2 years seems highly unlikely.

What seems more likely is that there is a software bug only triggered by certain actions which some people do and some don’t. Or perhaps firmware was written for an original chipset which was changed on the fly due to supply constraints and the firmware was thought to be fully compatible with the new chipset but it actually isn’t.

I would be willing to bet a very large sum of money that in a month or so another software update will be released that addresses this issue.
We’ve been saying this for a year and a half. That said, on the new firmware, mine has been mostly fine. I’ll get the occasional reboot or crash, but even my 20 Camry crashes on occasion and they are the kings of reliability. I would love it if another came out that just addressed stability.
 
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2021 Outback Touring XT
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We’ve been saying this for a year and a half. That said, on the new firmware, mine has been mostly fine. I’ll get the occasional reboot or crash, but even my 20 Camry crashes on occasion and they are the kings of reliability. I would love it if another came out that just addressed stability.
Just the same, what’s more likely, that they’ve been making and using a faulty chip that’s been erroneously passing multiple QC checks for years, or that there’s a single bug in a single line of code?
 

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2020 Onyx
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10,336 Posts
Well I'm certainly hoping it's just software which can be fixed with a flash, but there's no discernable pattern to whose system reboots. Has anyone without Nav had a spontaneous reboot?
 
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