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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello to all. We picked up a 99 Outback Legacy, 2.5, wagon. After getting it home, it would no longer idle, starts fine then dies out after about 5 seconds, runs down the road great, but no idle. Although there was no CEL's, I did a scan. I recovered 2 codes.....is it normal for this vehicle to have codes without a CEL? OR, could someone have pulled the bulb from the cluster? I have also been looking for a FSM, but it appears that it is a 12 volume set, at about $50-100 each.
So, the codes I have are; 1) PO325, knock sensor, one circuit bank or single sensor.
2) PO731, Gear 1 incorrect ratio.
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
 

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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
Hello to all. We picked up a 99 Outback Legacy, 2.5, wagon. After getting it home, it would no longer idle, starts fine then dies out after about 5 seconds, runs down the road great, but no idle. Although there was no CEL's, I did a scan. I recovered 2 codes.....is it normal for this vehicle to have codes without a CEL? OR, could someone have pulled the bulb from the cluster? I have also been looking for a FSM, but it appears that it is a 12 volume set, at about $50-100 each.
So, the codes I have are; 1) PO325, knock sensor, one circuit bank or single sensor.
2) PO731, Gear 1 incorrect ratio.
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
I have a knock sensor ordered and on the way. Would a bad knock sensor cause poor/no idle?
The car idled fine when I test drove it. It was delivered to me by tilt up trailer, about half way from home. Purchased 4 hours from home and part of the deal. Any potential issues from the steep incline? ie fuel tank crud being dislodged and clogging screen? The filler neck is extremely rusted and i have a new one to put in, but need idle first.
So far I have replaced the air filter and fuel filter and the short fuel lines in the area of the filter. Oil and filter and atf and filter to be replaced soon, but need idle to check atf level.
 

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(formerly) 03 H6 OBW , (presently) 06 WRX Sportwagon & 2021 Honda CR-V
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well, several things here, I can address 1 or2

knock sensors are often bad on older cars. They are inexpensive (one of the few sensors where aftermarkets seem OK) and easy to replace. Do a search for more details.

There is a - thumb sized? - hose that runs from the intake to the IACV on the throttle body. If it is loose, the car won't idle well, or at all.

you can find FSMs online in pdf .
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
well, several things here, I can address 1 or2

knock sensors are often bad on older cars. They are inexpensive (one of the few sensors where aftermarkets seem OK) and easy to replace. Do a search for more details.

There is a - thumb sized? - hose that runs from the intake to the IACV on the throttle body. If it is loose, the car won't idle well, or at all.

you can find FSMs online in pdf .
Thank you for the quick info! I will be going out shortly to locate the knock sensor, I purchased a Bosch brand, I hope this is a recommended brand. I will be replacing all of the vacuum lines shortly. I will immediately inspect the IACV line.
 

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'03 outback limited, '01 Outback Limited, '01 Legacy L wagon, '96 Legacy Brighton wagon
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Check and probably replace the plugs and wires. Check all ground cables and connections.

The bad knock sensor shouldn't affect the idle much, if any at all, but my Sub experience with that is with the 2.2 motor, (my '96) which has run with a bad sensor for 3 years with zero affect.

There is a post somewhere giving a link to the digital FSM.

Not related to the idle problem, but one other thing to check is the AC cooler and radiator for dead bugs and road debris - unless that has already been done, by the previous owner, the radiator is most likely 1/2 plugged up.
 

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Thank you for the quick info! I will be going out shortly to locate the knock sensor, I purchased a Bosch brand, I hope this is a recommended brand. I will be replacing all of the vacuum lines shortly. I will immediately inspect the IACV line.
scans of the factory service manuals:

these are in US spec years. make sure when reading things on the internet that you are reading for the north american spec year 1999 with the EJ25D.
(and not world spec 1999 with the EJ251 in the new body)

steer clear of bosch things if you can, leave them for the Germans.

Denso / NGK are what to buy for subarus. (so like NGK plugs and wires are the only way to go)

knock sensors are pretty generic though, like a doorman can work fine in anything.

(and at least the knock sensors make particular codes,...and its enough to make the car idle funny or die)

beware if pulling apart the IACV to look / clean it you may need a brand new gasket in hand, as the old one will be too brittle or hard to get the parts back together.

on the transmission...I am presuming this is a 4EAT: drain and fill with new plain dex 3 type. (walmart's supertech is fine) making sure to drain the trans and not the front differential.

total volume is 2 gallons. 1 in the pan 1 in the pump. a drain or a suction up the dipstick will get 1 gallon.
if you are more adventurous, you can open a cooler line to get 2 gallons out with the car running and sucking the new in. (something I would leave to pro-mechanic that has done it many times,...as I have only seen it done, ...and some things I just don't want to break).

good news: plenty of EJ25D in the pick and pulls due to melted engines from head gaskets....so easy to round up a perfectly matching outback trans.

is there any grabbing or growling while making slow figure 8 turns? = torque bind from running mixed tires
 
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oh, and as to codes: you can have pending codes that have not lit the dash light yet.

but the check engine light should come on and test for a few seconds, right after you turn the key in the on position. (just like the others)
 
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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Check and probably replace the plugs and wires. Check all ground cables and connections.

The bad knock sensor shouldn't affect the idle much, if any at all, but my Sub experience with that is with the 2.2 motor, (my '96) which has run with a bad sensor for 3 years with zero affect.

There is a post somewhere giving a link to the digital FSM.

Not related to the idle problem, but one other thing to check is the AC cooler and radiator for dead bugs and road debris - unless that has already been done, by the previous owner, the radiator is most likely 1/2 plugged up.

Thank you, have NGK Plugs "G" type and wires as well. A/C not working. The car sat for +/- 10 years, so probably needs a charge, but here, North of the 45th, not a big deal.
I spotted the grounds on the strut support tops......any hidden ones? Typical culprits?

We just got the car, less than a week, expecting some issues, since it sat so long. Good new (used) tires and rotors/pads by the PO. Trying to take the issues one at a time, by priority.

I think I let my guard down when it ran so well at test drive. Really not happy that there was no CEL's but two codes. Someone is hiding something. It was obviously sitting as everything was black, moss growing on underside of hatch, some wouldnt clean off, yet! Inside of all doors, black, gas fill door black. Engine itself dry, no real leakage, bolt heads a little rusty, but no recent wrench marring. Tracks straight, brakes straight, no vibration at 80mph, so I figured it was worth a shot.

Thanks again.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
oh, and as to codes: you can have pending codes that have not lit the dash light yet.

but the check engine light should come on and test for a few seconds, right after you turn the key in the on position. (just like the others)

Hmmm, I will watch closer at start up. I remember seeing an "at oil temp" light at start. Not sure of that one, never seen that before. It did come on after 3 hours of driving, but I stopped to see what I could see/smell. Nothing, and was off when I got back in.
 

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Hmmm, I will watch closer at start up. I remember seeing an "at oil temp" light at start. Not sure of that one, never seen that before. It did come on after 3 hours of driving, but I stopped to see what I could see/smell. Nothing, and was off when I got back in.
all the cluster lights test at start up. (see a owners manual to see all that should light up).

as for gas engines that sit for10 years.

whatever crap is in the gas tank and lines gets pushed to the fuel filter. so even if the tank was virtually dry, anything that was left in it gets pumped forward. = so the vehicle will run fine for a few hours and then start to fail.

get a new under the hood fuel filter and some rubber lines. (the lines on things this old get very hard, and you probably can't remove them, and put them on again without,...and the fuel filter has fluted tips so it fights you getting the lines off and putting the lines back on,....even if you stretch them with a needle nose pliers and hot water.)

seafoam is a $7.00 jug of greatness to digesting varnish in lines that hare too crappy to pull apart. (maybe run a can of it with full tanks until you get things straight. as a cleaner the car can run on it straight, but its not volatile enough to get a start on it)
 
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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Ha, no owners manual came with the car. Getting one off ebay. This is part of my "lostness", if that is a word. Further complicated by being an old guy, with, nearly no computer skills. New fuel filter and lines done yesterday.
There are 4 icons along the bottom of the cluster: 1) a battery, 2) the word "BRAKE", 3) at oil temp, and 4) ABS.
In the Lower tach face, there is an oil can (center), and to the right of that "airbag".

Furthering my thought that the CEL has been disable, ie bulb removed.
 

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1995 Legacy 2.2L | 2005 Outback XT 2.5L
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Check and probably replace the plugs and wires. Check all ground cables and connections.

The bad knock sensor shouldn't affect the idle much, if any at all, but my Sub experience with that is with the 2.2 motor, (my '96) which has run with a bad sensor for 3 years with zero affect.

There is a post somewhere giving a link to the digital FSM.

Not related to the idle problem, but one other thing to check is the AC cooler and radiator for dead bugs and road debris - unless that has already been done, by the previous owner, the radiator is most likely 1/2 plugged up.
My 2.2 idles weird when the knock sensor is acting up (sometimes after a wash of the engine bay) but it has never completely stalled out. I would start there as it is a problem that is throwing a code either way. If it doesn't solve the problem, at least you have a new knock sensor lol
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
My 2.2 idles weird when the knock sensor is acting up (sometimes after a wash of the engine bay) but it has never completely stalled out. I would start there as it is a problem that is throwing a code either way. If it doesn't solve the problem, at least you have a new knock sensor lol
I received the knock sensor in yesterdays mail. I will get it installed in a couple days, as my immediate schedule does not allow time. I ordered an owners manual too. Look forward to receiving it too.
I agree, the knock sensor needs to be replaced, I'll go from there.
 

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I received the knock sensor in yesterdays mail. I will get it installed in a couple days, as my immediate schedule does not allow time. I ordered an owners manual too. Look forward to receiving it too.
I agree, the knock sensor needs to be replaced, I'll go from there.
You know the easy way to replace the KS, right? Don't follow the FSM method and remove the manifold. You can reach the bolt with an extension, and a 12" pair of needle nose pliers helped a lot.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
You know the easy way to replace the KS, right? Don't follow the FSM method and remove the manifold. You can reach the bolt with an extension, and a 12" pair of needle nose pliers helped a lot.
I have read the replies from everyone and dont think it will be an issue. Right now, I am in the middle of a convertible top replacement. I must have this done by the first week of August.......This is the first top replacement for me, so I am being quite careful. Rusted bolts are testing my......patients, skills, and self control.

Thanks for the support! I can use plenty right now.
 
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