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It appears that recently more companies are trying to bring wagons to the market and make people think they are cool by calling them a "Shooting Brake". Is "Wagon" not cool...Did the GM and Ford wagons of the late 70's and 80's destroy the coolness of wagons? At one time Chevy had the Nomad, Chrysler had the woodie, so between the 50's and the 70's something truly went haywire

Instead of "Outback" what if Subaru named our vehicle the Legacy Shooting Brake. Would that make it cool? Would they have to make it all silver and put a supercharger on it?

I think what makes a Subaru a Subaru is not Love, but rather its quirkyness. Subaru cars are owned by people who want it all, but are ok with some quirks. Sure our CVT's whistle like those wooden train whistles we played with as children, the front end looks like the offspring of a praying mantis and a ring-tailed lemur, but we love the utility of it all. Most cars out there compromise on the worst of things from an engineering standpoint while Subaru continues to make cars better during the generation. Stretching out generations a little longer is ok so long as you improve it year to year. Getting people to like Subaru actually comes with ownership. you see I really did not consider buying a Subaru until I started talking to owners and I really could not justify getting one until I drove one. I am a car nut and continually look at Car & Driver and Road and Track. New cars intrigue me and on the surface Subaru as a company was not one of the companies that I considered. I am so glad I did finally consider them. The Outback is not a sports car. It doesn't do 0-60 in 2.9 seconds (unless you strapped an ICBM to the factory roof rack). It is wierd and people that own them are considered wierd by most. I am ok with being wierd
 

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Wagons are for carrying diapers or at least that's what Don Draper and his buddies would like you to believe.

SUV's are for people with active, outdoor lifestyles or at least people that want to look like they have an active, outdoor lifestyle.
 

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Subaru = Smarter instead of cooler...

"Love is what makes a Subaru" comes from realizing you can go anywhere in comfort, frugally and safely with some unconventional engineering (e.g., OB roof racks and "lifted wagons" before lifted wagons were cool). And after shopping all the 25-30K CUVs, there's no other SUV that handles or feels as premium inside (other than the new Ford Escape that I also liked but was pricey for similar equipment levels plus I just am not a fan of turbos in the long-run even though I know they're going to be mainstream the way CAFE is leading us...)

Therefore, I declare the reality is that after 20+ years of SUVs and now $4 a gallon gas, some of us have wised up to be smarter instead of cooler.
 

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Considering why I got mine, I'd say AWD is really what makes a Subaru, a Subaru.

But...

They blew that with the BRZ. Really, couldn't manage to come up with AWD for that? I mean, its not like you can buy basically the EXACT SAME CAR with a 'cooler' name badge, right? Wouldn't want to confuse the market with a distinguishing feature, would we?

At least the new Outback has big fogs again. I now actually spot new ones well before I get to them.
 

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It must be....

....all those quirky-things we all need to deal with, kind of binds us together, like one big un-happy family. :(

I'm thinking of the oil-leak problems with the 2.5 heads:confused:, valve covers and head gaskets (things that, in most other cars, would not ever be an issue out to 200,000+ miles)!:mad::17:
 

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For me:
- symmetrical AWD
- boxer engine
- longitudial engine
- reasonable, no-bullshit cars built for a purpose, not for stupid marketing
 

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SUVs are for ignorant and wasteful dumb heads (a.k.a. Americans) who are selfish, fat wannabes of what they aren't, with overblown desire of immediate gratification for all their whims.
My SUV might finally be sold and I'm American, in my 50s weighing 150 pounds, hardly wasteful, very thoughtful and careful about instant gratification.

My SUV served my company and work very well. I was able to get rid of my pickup truck, carry passengers, pull a 2 axle trailer when needed. Subaru nor any car company had a suitable alternative when I bought it and the Outback may still prove insufficient.

The Outback just can't do all the SUV can so I'll weigh keeping it against renting a pickup truck when needed before I sell it (SUV).

I suppose I could just one time try it for being in line to drop kids off at school that's only blocks away but we prefer feet and bikes when they make sense.

My SUV spent most of it's life driving about 3500 - 6000 miles a year and doing work or utility. I'll bet that's a lot less wasteful or selfish as you put it than people who have 20, 30, 40 or more mile one way commutes to work in economy cars.

Back to topic: To me the name badge, boxer engine and all wheel drive make it a Subaru. Some long time Subaru owners say mine (gen 4, rev b, Outback EyeSight) is not a real Subaru. To that I point out the name badge, boxer, all wheel drive and it being the first model really good for a family of 5 and my work.
 

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He's talking about the European way of thinking about SUVs.
 

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They blew that with the BRZ. Really, couldn't manage to come up with AWD for that? I mean, its not like you can buy basically the EXACT SAME CAR with a 'cooler' name badge, right? Wouldn't want to confuse the market with a distinguishing feature, would we?
Really?

Have you not looked into the BRZ at all?

The engine is much too low and too far rearward to allow AWD, at least any style of AWD that Subaru has ever done before.

That is exactly the same set of properties which make it so fun as a RWD coupe.
 

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They blew that with the BRZ. Really, couldn't manage to come up with AWD for that? I mean, its not like you can buy basically the EXACT SAME CAR with a 'cooler' name badge, right? Wouldn't want to confuse the market with a distinguishing feature, would we?
There's nothing cool about a Scion. Toyota wants you to think it's what the cool kids drive but I'm not drinking the Kool Aid.
 

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As time goes on, I'd say "quirky" becomes inaccurate as a description of Subaru other than their devotion to boxer engines. Nothing really quirky about any current Subaru besides perhaps the XV.

"Quirky" and "niche" vehicles don't pay large executive salaries.
 

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may be second in looks to more "proper wagons" like Volvo XC70 or MB E350 / E63
Volvos and MBs look their best in the eyes of the repair shop owner.

..."The quality goes in before the name falls off."

Looby
 

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My SUV might finally be sold and I'm American, in my 50s weighing 150 pounds, hardly wasteful, very thoughtful and careful about instant gratification.

My SUV served my company and work very well. I was able to get rid of my pickup truck, carry passengers, pull a 2 axle trailer when needed. Subaru nor any car company had a suitable alternative when I bought it and the Outback may still prove insufficient.

The Outback just can't do all the SUV can so I'll weigh keeping it against renting a pickup truck when needed before I sell it (SUV).

I suppose I could just one time try it for being in line to drop kids off at school that's only blocks away but we prefer feet and bikes when they make sense.

My SUV spent most of it's life driving about 3500 - 6000 miles a year and doing work or utility. I'll bet that's a lot less wasteful or selfish as you put it than people who have 20, 30, 40 or more mile one way commutes to work in economy cars.

Back to topic: To me the name badge, boxer engine and all wheel drive make it a Subaru. Some long time Subaru owners say mine (gen 4, rev b, Outback EyeSight) is not a real Subaru. To that I point out the name badge, boxer, all wheel drive and it being the first model really good for a family of 5 and my work.
Our SUV did about 4000 miles a year and generally was packed full of butts and stuff when it did get used. 99.9% of all our trips are done with the OB and prior to that our Legacy. The old SUV is paid for really costs us nothing and my neighbor who drives 200+miles a week for work in his prius burns way more fuel than the SUV does all year.

The OB tows our boats - tows our tent trailer and generally sees most road trips unless we have grand parents who live close by tagging along.
 

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Volvos and MBs look their best in the eyes of the repair shop owner.

..."The quality goes in before the name falls off."

Looby
Nice! Very close friend does high end custom electrical and interior work his number one brand he hates working on is volvo given the quality of the electronics are as he puts it the worst they see of any maker. He likes Mercedes primarily due to the quality of the materials and parts they use however he said the number one issue with Mercedes is their complexity and 99% of the time the issues are caused by mechanics who can't actually fix the problem.

BMW he says lacks quality from the physical door cards and interior items - to the electrical systems and even the body and frame in some cases. He said the only thing he likes about them are their engines. He jokes if you can put a BMW engine in a Toyota camry with Mercedes Benz quality in the materials you would have a kick ass product! HA HA
 

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You should address your passages to Europeans not me. The lifestyles are quite different in here and over there. Europeans have more advanced public transportation infrastructure, so that they don't have to commute 20 - 40 mile one way in a car but on the HSR (High-speed rail) 300 km/h (185 mph) Eurorail trains at much lower price per mile than Americans can dream of.
We always take the trains in Europe whenever we can; most countries there have great systems. However, your statement implies that rail travel in Europe is cheap; it's not. We always buy a rail pass before we go, because they come at a good discount. And Japan is even higher- a railpass if you're going to do a lot of traveling on the shinkansen is practically a must.
I've also read that those great public transportation systems are heavily subsidized....by the big taxes on motor fuel.
 

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SUVs are for ignorant and wasteful dumb heads (a.k.a. Americans) who are selfish, fat wannabes of what they aren't, with overblown desire of immediate gratification for all their whims.
You don't happen to be an English Wikipedia editor, do you?
Thanks for stereotyping. I'll be sure to go sell my Outback and get a big fat SUV now. :rolleyes:
 

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You don't happen to be an English Wikipedia editor, do you?
Thanks for stereotyping. I'll be sure to go sell my Outback and get a big fat SUV now. :rolleyes:
LOL I happen to know a few people in Europe who own very large thursty SUV's one was even purchased here in the States and shipped back to Italy. Funny thing is not a single one of them use it as a daily driver and every single one of them use it for heavy hauling work.

The perception that Americans buy massive V8 powered vehicles for daily use is pretty much a thing of the past. It is and has been a growing trend even seen here on these Forums of people either selling or parking their huge truck or SUV and getting a Subaru wagon.

Nearly all the people in the US who do own v8 powered vehicles - use them as a 3rd car when they need the space or hauling ability or in the case of a muscle car - on the weekend when they want to have a little muscle car fun. Which case I would argue that the American auto consumer is more and more like those in Europe today than the classic all American's drive 8mpg V8 piles of ****. LOL
 
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