So far only direct injected 2.5 (non turbo) has a TCV (Themo Control Valve instead of a Thermostat) but anyways here's a link to the lawsuit but I can't find documentation about the final judgement?

https://www.classaction.org/media/austermann-et-al-v-subaru-of-america-inc-et-al.pdf

 

looks like the affected part number is unchanged. Design change to the part, released back in 2021. The service bulletin doesn't say there is a different warranty for that part though.

tsb attached.




the complaint requesting a jury trial was filed november 24, 2023.... the court still has to respond to that request. It's a long way from a judgement yet.

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Subaru used to care a lot more for their loyal customers. Not so much any more. It’s all about the $$$ and the love marketing bulls**t they spew through advertising Typical big business.

 

Sadly, they don't have the VINs for impacted Outback and Legacy listed. Mine was a VERY late model year 21 production (May 2021), fingers crossed that mine has the updated part, but apparently that can't be determined unless Subaru tells us which VINs have the bad parts or it gets removed from my engine for inspection...

 

The VIN break for Outback has been updated and it affects 2022 as well. See SB.09.04.21R

 

Ordinarily I'm not hugely sympathetic for people who come looking for a payout, or free maintenance, just because their car needs a slightly expensive repair. Once you're out of warranty that's just the cost of ownership. Things break. New designs are introduced that fix original design weaknesses.

But in this case, where a tried-and-true $25 mechanical thermostat is replaced with a $350 electronic control valve, I really hope the courts force Subaru to learn a punishing, expensive lesson for this mindless over-engineering in the pursuit of 0.00001% emissions improvements. The repair process was clearly dead last on the engineers' priority list - with the mechanical thermostat, all you had to do was pull the lower radiator hose and remove the 2 housing bolts. To get at this electronic valve, the entire intake gets disassembled, manifold removed, and fuel pipe replaced. Not to mention all the other associated gaskets that have to be removed on the way.

Subaru could have gotten ahead of this by at least extending the warranty on the TCV to 10yr/100k. Now, I hope that at the bare minimum, they are ordered to recall every single one of the faulty design TCVs.

 

The letter I received today (June 7, 2024) states the warranty has been extended to 15 yrs or 150,000 miles which ever occurs first.

 

My wife's car was built right about the time the change to the valve occurred and I can't help but wonder if it's involved in the TSB. Wish they had a VIN list or starting point.

 

My wife's car was built right about the time the change to the valve occurred

When was that?

 

I thought your wife's car was a turbo, or am I confusing you with someone else? The turbo version doesn't have a TCV.

 

My car is the turbo, wife's car is N/A.

 

What are the ramifications of a failure of this component? Coolant leaks? No cabin heat? Severe engine overheating?
It can leave you stranded on the roadside??

 

What are the ramifications of a failure of this component? Coolant leaks? No cabin heat? Severe engine overheating?
It can leave you stranded on the roadside??

Subaru Tech here. Almost 100% of them throw an "out of range/performance" code and just operate in a fully open state. Seen mild buildup of coolant on the exterior but it's usually the dry crusty's you get from a super crazy slow leak. Never seen one ever leave a customer stranded. They are a pain to replace but I have only ever done 1 customer pay TCV. The other 99% have been covered under warranty.

 

the first thing subaru will do is file a motion to dismiss the lawsuit. Those are interesting to read - what the rebuttal to the claims in the original filing are. That's likely 5-6 months out from now. The final judgement will be about three years from now, if it goes like the last few I read through.

I read through the complaint - lots of it you can skip, it's just copy and paste complaints from the NHTSA site, the rest is almost worth reading. If I'm still interested in this 2 to 3 years down the road when its done, I'll read the final order and judgement docs.

I guess if anyone has a repair that isn't being covered under a warranty now, save all your receipts, because sometime in 2027 there might be a settlement website with a form you can download and get that money back.

 

So the turbo uses a standard thermostat? That's good to know I have one less thing to worry about.

 

For now till they bring the electronic thermal management to the turbo setup to try and improve it for better fuel millage. It's all for chasing the almighty litre per 100km (miles per gallon for my southern folk)

 

Thanks to all for posting and the information. Read about this yesterday, kind of disappointing to know at some point part will probably fail and potentially not covered depending on circumstances. Battery failed last year (out of warranty due to mileage) and was planning on purchasing an AGM battery. I do not get on this forum as much as I would like but quick search and read about the replacement/upgrade Subaru was doing. Called dealer next morning and no problem, dealership knew about it and took care of it. So hopefully Subaru will do what is right with this depending on how many complaints they get in the future for those past the 5 year mark etc.

 

Thanks to all for posting and the information. Read about this yesterday, kind of disappointing to know at some point part will probably fail and potentially not covered depending on circumstances.

ALL parts ARE going to fail at some point. The maker promises that a part will last only so long, that's what warranties are for. Beyond that the maker holds no liability, and anything they do after warranty expires is purely good will. So expect parts to fail and expect to pay for them outside of warranty.
I'll be amazed if the class action goes anywhere. Under warranty? Covered. Outside of warranty? Not covered. It really is that easy.

 

I wonder if this TCV is the reason the XT gets the PTC that the early gen 6 2.5's didn't get. The TCV might allow for earlier flow of warm coolant to the heater core, allowing for faster heat in the cabin.

 

Faster is relative. About 3 miles in mine before the heater blows hot air. Oil temperature hits 100F about then.

 

The difference in this situation is that Subaru has revised the part to resolve the issue, so in this case, Subaru has determined that the part in question is more failure prone and decided to revise the part.

Subaru has also revised some other parts, like the window regulator, but a window regulator failure isn't catastrophic. I'm not sure how to characterize a TCV failure but it's definitely worse than a window regulator.

I'm not saying I'm on the side of the class action lawsuit or against it. Just saying that the TCV valve issue isn't just the normal "some parts wear out" or "every part has a certain failure rate"

 

Right, it's no different than any other run-of-the-mill TSB. We went through at least three on our new model, very early production '14 Mazda3; a couple for front-end clunks (binding tie-rod ends and noisy springs) and one for the rear caliper mounting bracket (rusts, binds caliper, causes one pad to wear to nothing while the other's fine).

If the TCV fails open and doesn't cause stalling or catastrophic immediate failure, it's absolutely a TSB issue rather than a recall. Just sucks that it's an expensive fix for most people who aren't equipped to do it themselves out of warranty.

 

Good thoughts about the TCV issue and I think the non-turbo needs a TCV to heat the engine up faster, not for human heater core responsiveness, but to prevent fuel dilution of the oil. This change coincided with direct injection. A cold direct injection engine suffers from fuel dilution.

 

Since I have a 2021 2.5i, I'm understanding my car has the TCV. Should I have this replaced under warranty (I don't believe it has failed, but my car is getting fairly poor fuel mileage, unless I'm driving longer distances at highway speeds).

 

Yours may or may not have the new improved version; regardless, that's up to the dealer to decide. They're not going to change it because you want them to. If there are no associated fault codes, it's probably fine.

 

Newly revised today. I believe they added more legacy/outbacks to the tsb.

 

my 2020 limited Outback was retrieved this morning from the shop with the new tcv installed. Drove less than 5 miles, car came to a screeching halt on the highway, every light on the dash illuminated and the car stalled. Barely got off road and almost got run over by an 80 mph semi. Had it towed back. Now wondering if install went wrong or what. Any thoughts?

 

Did you smell coolant or see any steam from the engine compartment?

Sounds like a poor install. Sorry you have to go through that.

On a side note, I just installed one today in a customers car. Figured I would take some side by sides. No exterior difference. Will see if I can post them from my mobile.

(Edit, wasn't elliottdonna66's vehicle I was working on lol)

 

I got excited thinking my VIN had the new part, then I realized that portion of my VIN starts with an 'M' rather than an 'N'...

 

 

Judging from your pictures, you can clearly see the manufacturing date clearly on the unit. I wonder if it Is visible after the installation?

 

I believe it was noted earlier in the thread that it is NOT as it's hidden by the intake or some other part that needs to be removed for the repair.

 

This part just failed for me on my 2021 Outback at 62,000 miles. Repair nearly $2,000. I've appealed to the Subaru advocacy folks to see if they are willing to help. Anyone have any success getting them to help this close to the warranty expiration?

 

My 2020 Forester had this happen last night on a country road in the rain. I could not drive it at all. I had it towed to the dealer -- thank god for AAA!! The dealers say it's under warranty but I haven't talked over what will happen going forward. If it's replaced by the same part what is to stop it happening again? Very disappointed in Subaru.

 

If it's replaced by the same part what is to stop it happening again?

The TSB posted earlier in the thread indicates a redesigned and more robust (internally) part is the replacement.

 

I just had the TCV failure last weekend on my 2020 Outback Touring, the symptoms I observed were a solid check engine light, eye sight disabled, RAB disabled, Front collision warning off, essentially christmas lighting on the dashboard and NO Heating from the blowers. The dealership tells me the warranty will cover the part but they do not have it readily available and will have to be ordered, the vehicle is still with the dealer meanwhile I am wondering if the replacement will be the same plastic made TCV or will the replacement be any better? Also does the replacement come with any warranty?

 

I put photos up just a few messages above this. It's appears exactly the same on the outside but internals are improved to prevent damage to the inside.

 

It’s hard to tell from the diagram, is this part located under the intake manifold?

 

Yes it is under the intake manifold.

 

I'm currently waiting in a dealer's service department after a P2682 code appeared while on a road trip, currently 500 miles from home. Guessing I'm going to be told it's the TCV. I'm at 67K so just outside of the powertrain warranty.

Hope they can get it replaced quickly and get me on my way, ugh.

 

I'm currently waiting in a dealer's service department after a P2682 code appeared while on a road trip, currently 500 miles from home. Guessing I'm going to be told it's the TCV. I'm at 67K so just outside of the powertrain warranty.

Hope they can get it replaced quickly and get me on my way, ugh.

This is an expensive repair due to the labor required to get to the TCV. Save your repair invoice and reach out to SOA when you get home—see if they’ll reimburse you for some of the expense.