It's because you put LEDs in the high beam sockets. Without modification, they will either flicker or run full bright instead of the reduced output of the halogen highs used as DRLs. When Auto flips on the low beams, they shut off.

Good thread

 

All lights in and out, have been replaced with LED's but have been for a couple years without problems. I did replace the LED bulbs after the problem started to see if it helped but it didn't help. I did research the bulbs originally to get ones that were recommended for it. They have the built in resistor (?).

 

Did you just replace an LED bulb by chance? A lot of LEDs are polarised. They will only work plugged in, in the right direction. If you have something as dumb as a 194 LED bulb flopped to the wrong power/ground side, it can really mess up the entire circuit.

 

All lights in and out, have been replaced with LED's but have been for a couple years without problems. I did replace the LED bulbs after the problem started but it didn't help. I did research the bulbs to get ones that were recommended for it. They have the built in resistor (?).

 

I'll stand with my diag. What bulbs exactly were in there before you changed them? Perhaps they were DRL compatible, but those are rare and expensive. If you don't care about the DRLs, you can use these relays to disable the function and your brights will work normally. See the thread I linked.

Amazon.com: Subaru 2005-2018 Fog Light Driving Lamp Relay Legacy Outback New 82501AG05B : Automotive

Buy Subaru 2005-2018 Fog Light Driving Lamp Relay Legacy Outback New 82501AG05B: Automotive - Amazon.com ✓ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases

www.amazon.com

 

Thanks - I do think DRL are a safety help but if I was to do this how would I go about it? Is it just this one and pull which? Thanks!

 

Yeah, if you put LEDs in the high beams, you're potentially driving around with your high beams on all day long. Not a good look, IMO, and inconsiderate to other drivers, particularly under lower-light conditions (before the low beams are activated assuming you use the auto function). I see more and more Subarus running this setup and find it extremely irritating.

Anyway, are you saying you replaced the headlight switch on the stalk? Did you do any diagnostics before that? Like simply reinstalling the original incandescent bulbs? Aftermarket LED units vary widely in build quality and just because they still light up doesn't mean they're functioning properly. Some are also known to cause a variety of strange electrical issues due to interference created by the driver circuitry.

 

Solved: It was the LED bulbs. I didn't think of the bulbs due to having them work for over 2 yrs but I switched them out to the EOM and all worked again. I had heard of the flickering problem and thought I was lucky that we didn't get that - (we converted 3 cars) but had never heard of the "full bright" problem. Also a few people told me it was the headlight switch or relay - so wasn't looking at the bulbs themselves. I'll have to decide about losing the DRL's for the other relays but for now I can just drive without flipping my switch on and off at all stops. Thanks!!!

 

I might be misunderstanding the description of what is happening that's quoted below, but it seems to me it's operating properly.

When the car is in Drive the following happens: In OFF position - the high
beams are on.

Sounds normal. When the engine is running, the parking brake is Off, and the transmission (CVT) is not in Park, the DRLs will be on. The DRLs are (normally) the high beams but at reduced brightness.

The use of LED high beam bulbs could mean that the bulbs appear to be the same brightness when in DRL mode or in regular High beam mode because the small reduction in current for DRLs that would slightly dim incandescent bulbs, might not have any significant effect on the LED high beam bulbs.

In AUTO it's ok sometimes (normal headlights - sometimes
high beams) In Day running lights - high beams are on. In ON position - it's
ok -normal headlights are on.

That seems to be the way they're intended to work. In AUTO, when in bright surroundings, the AUTO control is essentially as if the switch is in the Off position, which brings it to the DRLs as mentioned above. When outside brightness goes down (heavy cloud, evening, night, under a bridge, in a tunnel etc), the AUTO control turns the headlights On. When the headlights are turned on, the DRLs are turned off, so the high beam bulbs go off.

From Chapter 3 ("Instruments and controls") of your 2015 Owners Manual:

 

I might be misunderstanding the description of what is happening that's quoted below, but it seems to me it's operating properly.


Sounds normal. When the engine is running, the parking brake is Off, and the transmission (CVT) is not in Park, the DRLs will be on. The DRLs are (normally) the high beams but at reduced brightness.

The use of LED high beam bulbs could mean that the bulbs appear to be the same brightness when in DRL mode or in regular High beam mode because the small reduction in current for DRLs that would slightly dim incandescent bulbs, might not have any significant effect on the LED high beam bulbs.


That seems to be the way they're intended to work. In AUTO, when in bright surroundings, the AUTO control is essentially as if the switch is in the Off position, which brings it to the DRLs as mentioned above. When outside brightness goes down (heavy cloud, evening, night, under a bridge, in a tunnel etc), the AUTO control turns the headlights On. When the headlights are turned on, the DRLs are turned off, so the high beam bulbs go off.

From Chapter 3 ("Instruments and controls") of your 2015 Owners Manual:
View attachment 571263

View attachment 571264

Hi - when I say high beams - I mean the bright lights - not the normal night time driving lights. These brights come on when the car is in drive and the light switch is in the off position and also when it is in the auto position. I have to move the switch to normal nighttime headlights to actually get those lights to work. Hope that clarifies.

Yeah, if you put LEDs in the high beams, you're potentially driving around with your high beams on all day long. Not a good look, IMO, and inconsiderate to other drivers, particularly under lower-light conditions (before the low beams are activated assuming you use the auto function). I see more and more Subarus running this setup and find it extremely irritating.

Anyway, are you saying you replaced the headlight switch on the stalk? Did you do any diagnostics before that? Like simply reinstalling the original incandescent bulbs? Aftermarket LED units vary widely in build quality and just because they still light up doesn't mean they're functioning properly. Some are also known to cause a variety of strange electrical issues due to interference created by the driver circuitry.

No - I'm going to do that now, with the original bulbs. I hadn't heard of that and since the LED's worked for so long i didn't know that could be it. My clock spring went out so I did the headlight switch on the stalk at the same time since several Subbie guys said that was the likely problem. The relays have also been mentioned as a potential cause of messing with the voltage, but not sure which one I would look to change out? Thanks!

 

I must admit, I didn't read the OP carefully, sounds like it's just the typical problem with an led in the high beam location. They don't have a DRL mode. It's pretty much all or nothing. As suggested, swap out the relays and you can enjoy the higher output high beams. But you will no longer have DRLs.

Note though that, while they may be brighter, some folks have reported less reach/throw from the high beams when LEDs are used. The lenses are designed for a filament light source so you could be messing up the optical alignment.

 

Note though that, while they may be brighter, some folks have reported less reach/throw from the high beams when LEDs are used. The lenses are designed for a filament light source so you could be messing up the optical alignment.

Besides a bad alignment, I don't see how a light could be "brighter", but not reach as far.

Also, isn't there only a chance of misalignment with projector housings?

I started a thread elsewhere on this site regarding LED drop-ins in reflector vs projector housings, but didn't get much input.
(Gen 4 - Drop-in LED Bulb Replacement: Reflector vs...)

TIA for any help

-JD

 

I was going to post a thread about this, but since this one ended on the exact same issue I was going to address....

Has anyone tried these "2 stroke" Morimoto LEDs?
They claim to be able to operate properly as DRLs when lower voltage is supplied. I'm about to order them because that's the only reason I haven't swapped mine all over to LED already, just the fogs...

https://www.morimotohid.com/morimoto-2-stroke-2stroke-h7-led-bulbs?quantity=1

9005: Morimoto's New 2Stroke 3.0 LED Fog Light Bulbs LED1517

6061 Aluminum, Copper Boards, and Philips Z ES Lumileds have been combined by Morimoto to make the new 9005 2Stroke 3.0 LED Headlight Bulb. Stronger Than Ever!

www.morimotohid.com

Regards,
JD

 

I've been waiting for someone to give some detailed feedback on the latest 2strokes - they've been available for over 2 years now. A search of the forum turned up this post from a Gen 4 owner who said the DRL voltage on his Outback wasn't low enough to trigger the DRL mode (but he was able to put a resistor in to get the job done):

LED low beams and OEM DRLs?

I’m on my second set of LED low-beam bulbs and I’m still not happy with the light output. The first pair were Xenon Depot’s Xtreme LED Pro bulbs. While a significant improvement over the stock halogens, I wasn’t blown away by the brightness. So now I’m trying Morimoto’s 2Stroke 3.0 bulbs...

www.subaruoutback.org

 

Thanks for the link! Very disappointing that they don't work as intended though.
At that combined cost + effort, I'll pass...

- JD

 

Note though that, while they may be brighter, some folks have reported less reach/throw from the high beams when LEDs are used.

Another characteristic that tricks some is the color temperature of LEDs is usually much hotter than halogens. But color temp is not lumens or candela.

 

Do the 2 Strokes have a second LED and a circuit that steers the current to the correct LED depending on what voltage it sees?

That said, I converted all my '15's lights, front and back, for less that the cost of one pair of them.

Ok, NM...

Disconnecting the bulb will only test from the harness to the bulb... the resistor is past the bulb...

 

when I say high beams - I mean the bright lights - not the normal night time driving lights. These brights come on when the car is in drive and the light switch is in the off position and also when it is in the auto position. I have to move the switch to normal nighttime headlights to actually get those lights to work. Hope that clarifies.

Not really.

The high beams are the headlight bulbs that are most inboard in the headlight housing. The low beams are the bulbs that are further out from the center of the car.

The high beam bulbs are used:

1) as high beams headlights when headlights are selected by the headlight switch and the dimmer switch is set to High beams;​

​

2) as the Daytime Running Lights, when the engine is running, the parking brake is Off, and the transmission (CVT) is not in Park. When used as the DRLs, the high beam bulbs are normally not as bright as when used as high beam headlights.​

This high beam arrangement was noted in post #8 above, and is described in the Owners Manual.

Below is a diagram of the headlight assembly, with the low beam and high beam headlights noted.

Are you saying that your lights are not operating this way?

 

No, they are not operating that way. The High beams headlights (what I was calling the "brights" above - that's what we called them where I grew up), are turning on at full brightness when the shifter is out of park and the headlight switch is in the off position or the auto position. This includes the DRL- only full brightness high beams. The only way I can get my Low beam lights to turn on when driving is by turning the headlight switch all the way up to the normal on position for low beams. The Auto position on the headlight switch only turns on the high beams. However, if the car shifter is in Park, all light positions on the headlight switch work properly. I replaced all my lights with LED's in the interior, exterior and all headlights about 2-3 yrs ago without any problems. This light problem has been going on for many months. (Also, last month I had to have the clock spring replaced due to the horn not working, which works now. I also replaced the headlight switch stick but that didn't help. In case there is a connection.)

 

The only way I can get my Low beam lights to turn on when driving is by turning the headlight switch all the way up to the normal on position for low beams. The Auto position on the headlight switch only turns on the high beams

Thanks. A different perspective.

So, with the headlight switch in the AUTO position, the only headlight bulbs that are ever on are the high beams at the front. Unlike what it's supposed to do, the AUTO position does not change the headlight bulb operation as it should when when moving between a fully lit environment, e.g., outside daytime when only the DRLs are on, and a dark situation, e.g., at night, with no street lights or other lighting, when the Low beams should be on.

A couple of things to verify: When the headlight switch is in the Off position, and the car is being driven, the DRLs (high beam bulbs) should be on, but I believe none of the external tail, clearance or license plate lights should be on. However, when the headlight switch is in the AUTO position and in a dark environment, the external tail, clearance and license plate lights should be On along with the Low beam headlight bulbs.

If, when in a dark surroundings and using the AUTO position, the tail, clearance and license plate lights do not come on, that, along with the high beam bulbs remaining on, would suggest it's not a headlght issue as such; rather the AUTO function is not working and when in the AUTO setting it's as if the headlight switch is in the Off position, and only the DRLs are functioning.

The all-important ambient light sensor is located on the top of the dashboard, near the windshield (page 3-44 of the Owners Manual). It could be damaged, perhaps from cleaning material used on the dash or work done under the dash. If the sensor is disconnected, or faulty in such a way as to be the same as a disconnection, it might appear to the AUTO function control circuit as if it's bright outside. That would result in the high beam bulbs, running as DRLs, remaining on all the time.

Also, the sensitivity setting for the light sensor can be adjusted. Perhaps check to see what the setting is now. (See page 3-41).

 

Thanks. A different perspective.

So, with the headlight switch in the AUTO position, the only headlight bulbs that are ever on are the high beams at the front. Unlike what it's supposed to do, the AUTO position does not change the headlight bulb operation as it should when when moving between a fully lit environment, e.g., outside daytime when only the DRLs are on, and a dark situation, e.g., at night, with no street lights or other lighting, when the Low beams should be on.

A couple of things to verify: When the headlight switch is in the Off position, and the car is being driven, the DRLs (high beam bulbs) should be on, but I believe none of the external tail, clearance or license plate lights should be on. However, when the headlight switch is in the AUTO position and in a dark environment, the external tail, clearance and license plate lights should be On along with the Low beam headlight bulbs.

If, when in a dark surroundings and using the AUTO position, the tail, clearance and license plate lights do not come on, that, along with the high beam bulbs remaining on, would suggest it's not a headlight issue as such; rather the AUTO function is not working and when in the AUTO setting it's as if the headlight switch is in the Off position, and only the DRLs are functioning.

The all-important ambient light sensor is located on the top of the dashboard, near the windshield (page 3-44 of the Owners Manual). It could be damaged, perhaps from cleaning material used on the dash or work done under the dash. If the sensor is disconnected, or faulty in such a way as to be the same as a disconnection, it might appear to the AUTO function control circuit as if it's bright outside. That would result in the high beam bulbs, running as DRLs, remaining on all the time.

Also, the sensitivity setting for the light sensor can be adjusted. Perhaps check to see what the setting is now. (See page 3-41).

Thank you for all the info you put into this post. I did check all these things and they are all working now normally. I changed the LED bulbs last night back to OEM bulbs based on post above and everything started working properly. The DRL's are now working at the proper brightness on off and auto positions - no more full high beam brightness. I didn't know that was a thing with LED bulbs and didn't think it could be the cause due to the LED bulbs I had working properly for over 2 yrs. In researching the issue of LED bulbs I see that it is hit and miss. Some people's work, some don't dim the high beam bulbs to the proper DRL intensity. Thanks again though for all the input. I'm saving the post for any future light diagnosis.

 

It was the LED bulbs causing the issue - replaced them with OEM bulbs and all started working normally.