I think you are nuts...

But I have never been able to be in the position to own a BMW...so I just ... think you are nuts.

I have had 6 Subarus...I think you are nuts.

BTW...no offernse. I just don't understand. Please deliver the BMW to tdck in Denver, I'll take it...thank you...

 

Very interesting....we're about to reach the end of our '14 BMW 328xiT Sport Wagon lease and are seriously considering an Outback....for the value proposition you clearly state. We've enjoyed our BMW, the fabulous Munich delivery and Spartanburg re-delivery process, its overall driving performance, interior/exterior styling and rich ($$$) features. My wife would echo your statement , "The Outback is very surefooted to drive and has a higher seating position that I prefer." Time will tell and I'm learning a lot in this forum about current Outbacks...and I thank you all for your posts.

 

Trade your Bavarian Wagon to me Please...those are choice...

 

My last 3 cars were BMWs. They are no longer the ultimate driving machines. They've become a little soft and more tuned to be family sedans. The Outback is clearly not as good handling as my last 5 series but I was surprised that it's not that far behind at normal highway speeds. One reason I didn't get another BMW is because they aren't really that great unless you get to the top of the line in each class. Even then other manufacturers have caught up. For example, my Camaro ZL1 will smoke the M3 on any track and it cost less.

 

My wife has a 10 535i 6 so manual. Nice car, fast, sure footed (has insanely expensive tires in different sizes front and back in some sport pkg) but rides sort of rough. My driving style has me liking the outback much better. The 16 outback outclasses the 10 bmw handily in the electronics category.

In some western states we had opportunity to drive over 80 continually for 100s of miles and the outback was fantastic; si cecum is a silver station wagon I don't feel like I am on a highway patrol watch list! .

In regular daily and weekend travels it does well too.

I can see the appeal of a bmw for certain drivers, my wife loves hers, but the utility of the outback wins for me.


Wmdpowell car name Roo2

 

I was in the left lane at 75 mph in a 55 zone behind a 3 Series BMW when a State Trooper came out of no where behind us, lights flashing as I moved over, guess who he bagged...? Yup, the 3 Series...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

Where the OB will really shine is cost of ownership starting around year 5.

 

My BMWs have held up quite well. Just the usual wear and tear items.

 

I would put the 3 Series closer to the Impreza / Crosstrek. The Outback would be more in line with the 5 Series.

$$$ - I think the 6 cylinder outback fully loaded comes in around $35k. Add another $5+ for the BMW.

Ground Clearance - The 3 Series is lower to the ground (good or bad depending on terrain). The X3 / X5 would be a closer match but that makes the $$$ gap even bigger. If you plan to stay in the urban jungle, then it doesn't really matter. Actual jungle will get the BMW out if its element very fast.

AWD - My opinion is Subaru is better. But, unless you get a LOT of snow & don't want to bring tires into the equation, I really don't see this being a major point.

Reliability / Repair - I believe BMW are great cars to lease. The dealer covers a lot of the maintenance. When that warranty expires is when it hurts. If you plan to trade it in before 75k, it doesn't matter but after 75k I would be scared to own a BMW. Parts and repair costs are no contest.

Prestige - The Subaru Limited is nice, but it is not a BMW. If that refinement is an issue, then case closed.

Handling - Simple law of physics, the BMW is down to the ground. That said, for something lifted off the ground as much as a Jeep Cherokee, The Outback handles well.

Stereotypes - Outbacks have the outdoorsy, tree hugger connotation. Here in Atlanta, BMWs are the choice of a$$holes. If you buy a BMW you need to learn to become the biggest a$$ you can while driving.

Final note. Audi & Volvo have closer competitors to the Outback (still a steep $$$ premium). For the $$$ I do not think there is a better all around vehicle available. There are bigger ones (Tahoe), there are more off road capable ones (Land Cruiser), there are more fuel efficient ones (Prius), there are better handling (Corvette), etc, etc. But as an all around contender, the Outback is hard to beat.

 

Couldn't agree more about Atlanta. Every other vehicle in my neighboorhood is a BMW. My OB and Stingray get lots more thumbs up, and that's real prestige. The BMW's all look the same, as are folks driving them. There's amazing diversity in Atlanta if you're not just another BMW driver try'n to impress your neighbor.

 

My wife drives an X5 and there is a noticeable difference in the quality and build. Just opening and closing the doors is a different feel and experience and that's not even getting into the differences in the engines and suspension. Let's not kid ourselves with the direct comparisons. But that being said...the Outback was a nice step up from my previous car (base model RAV4) and I've gotten more compliments on my car (both exterior and interior) than my wife with her car. Maybe something about the "expectation" of what a BMW is supposed to be.

I feel like both cars are well engineered in their own right...well maybe except for the fact that my wife had to pay to correct the camber in her rear wheels because it was causing the tires to wear out after 5k miles...she's not as spirited of a driver as BMW intended. And I'm pretty sure none of the turn signals on BMW's work either.

 

We considered buying a 320x BMW tourer when we were buying our outback, mostly because it was the only car with manual transmission and petrol engine out of those we were thinking about. It was about 3k cheaper in roughly comparable equipment (I'm not sure if it had adaptive cruise control), but the way it drove was a let-down after driving the XE jag, I could not see into curves due to thick A-pillars, and mostly- we were just impressed by the space the Outback had which this lacked.

 

I've had BMWs for 20 years, most currently a 2014 335xi. The gap between them and others used to be much larger than it is now. I find the solidity of the BMW and heft of its doors, etc more pleasant than the more hollow sounding Japanese cars, but in the end like our '16 3.6 as it is a far better value. 20K less and much better resale. Kinda hard to compare them directly as they vie for different markets. A wagon vs. a sports sedan really isn't an apples to apples comparison.

 

This is a great thread! I have owned a 2001 LLBean OBW since new. It is currently in the hands of my 19yr old. I basically lived that Subaru commercial of handing the keys to a young son and watched him drive off alone to work at scout camp for the summer with a tear in my eye (that was a few years ago). This all being said, around in 2009 I realized I needed to start looking for a replacement to my AWD 6-Cyl wagon. With that as my criteria, it narrowed the options tremendously. I had never paid any attention to the 5 series wagons until one day I saw one at work and decided that I wanted one. I started scouring forums to figure out what the perfect combination of options was. I test drove a couple here in Atlanta, but they are very few and far between. Finally in 2010 I found the perfect wagon with the exact options I wanted. I had a local dealer friend buy it at auction and transfer it down, they certified it, and, I bought it with a full 100Kmi warranty as well as the extended service plan. Knowing nothing about the BMW ownership, I spent a lot of time reading up on the 5 series in preparation for my wagon's arrival. Once I got it, it was amazing. So amazingly tight and connected to the road....I could sling it around corners like it was a huge go-cart...it's handling just blew me away. I kept it like a garage queen and hardly drove it and continued to drive my Subaru daily. Soon, though, my son started driving and thus I started driving the 530 wagon more. I then started thinking that at some point, my wagon was going to start costing me lots of $$ to maintain (especially after I had to spend $500 to get a new battery...yes I was naive and thought it could only be done by the dealer). So I sold it after owning it for only two years and only putting on maybe 20Kmi. I then bought a turbo OB and later another 6cyl (this time a 2009) but at no point could I get that drive quality from the 5series wagon back so I kept a constant eye on the 5 series wagon market. Eventually, I found another 530XiT...(I specifically targeted the 2007 model so as to be naturally aspirated) with the same packages my other wagon had: cold weather (heated seats and steering wheel), premium (leather, upgraded sound, etc), and sport package (21 way adjustable seats and sports steering wheel among other tidbits.

Now, at the end of the day, would I have spent $65K to buy it new over a $39K decked out 3.6OBW? No. Will a 3.6OBW be in my future some day? Probably...we'll see how the BMW maintenance goes. For now, though, there are not a lot of cars out there that drive like my current wagon except for the newer 5 series wagons but they have twin turbos and I just don't want turbos. I recently test drove a 3.6 with a friend and I pushed it a little around turns....it is no doubt a nice handling vehicle and no doubt one that will last as long as my current 01 has and at the end of the day cost way less to have owned it. But when it comes to the handling, and finish quality of the BMW, it just doesn't compare. The AWD works every but a sure-footedly as the OBW even in the snow. Although without the ground clearance of the OB, I have not explored much off-road!

I do need to point out, though, that part of what allows me to enjoy my BMW so much is the fact that I wrench on it myself. If I were to have to rely on dealerships to work on it for me, there's no way I could afford it.

Sorry this was so long but the Subaru/BMW comparison is always a near and dear subject to my heart!>

 

Excellent post.

I came to Subaru with over 20 years of driving BMW's (3s, 5s and X series)
Anybody that tries to blow smoke up your a** by saying the Outback is in the same league in handling and performance either doesn't know what they're talking about, or is just plain lying. Drive twisties at speed or in crosswinds and the difference is night and day. That's where BMW excels.

That said, I'm quite happy with my decision to trade my current generation X3 in on the outback. The Outback gives a lot of bang for the buck and is exceptionally versatile, but a performance luxury driving machine it is not.

 

I'm interested in this thread, never thought I'd see the BMW/Outback comparison discussed. In Jan I bought a 2016 3.6R with Eyesight, which replaced my wife's 2004 Toyota Sienna. No need to say how much of an improvement that was. But I kept my 2002 E39 BMW 540 sedan with Sport Pkg and 6-speed. Turns out I hardly drive the 540 any more (it has 70k miles). I still love to drive it but the OB is so pleasant and all the technology makes crowded highways less of a chore.

One thing about BMWs, at least the ones I've owned (motorcycles and cars) is that they are engineered to handle and perform well closer to their limits than other cars I've owned. I used to take my BMWs to the racetrack for 'high performance driving schools' (read 'drive as fast as you dare') at Lime Rock and NHIS, and was amazed at how well they did. I felt the cars were a lot better than the driver FWIW (grin) . Also, when traveling in Europe a couple of summers ago, I rented a 320 diesel automatic. That car did great on the autobahn at 110 mph, while getting excellent mpg. But, I don't go to the track anymore, and don't live in an area where 110mph is legal.

So, for the kind of driving I do now, the OB is pretty fine. Not sure it would do so well on the track or autobahn (has anyone got a report on that, BTW?). If I lived in Europe or was a lot younger, maybe I'd feel differently.

 

So, for the kind of driving I do now, the OB is pretty fine. Not sure it would do so well on the track or autobahn (has anyone got a report on that, BTW?). If I lived in Europe or was a lot younger, maybe I'd feel differently.

My car does better than I expected at 100 mph highway speeds. But my suspension and chassis are not stock. Granted the Gen3 XT is a different animal than a 2017 OB, but my suspension is way tighter. My stock suspension would have had me in a pine box by now, were my built rig acts like its tethered to the road.

I like my OB because I built it to perform, the stock car was just a canvas. I feel like I would have done very little to a 5-Series Wagon, I wouldn't need to.

 

I can throw in my two cents about this comparison, because I have both a 2016 3.6 OB and a 2008 750i with sports package (including active roll control and a 4.8 L normally aspirated V8). If the issue is good value and cost of maintenance, the BMW is out of the running. If the issue is absolute excellence, the OB is out of the running. In the BMW, the refinement, the quality of every detail and the care of assembly are in a different league from the OB. All that said, I'm inclined to use the Outback much more, even for long distance travelling, because of the Eyesight system, which is a huge help in heavy traffic. The BMW has an active cruise control system, which when I bought it in 2008 seemed stellar. (It is radar based, with an electrically heated, heavy glass radome for deicing.) But the ACC cuts out below 15 mph, which is of no help in traffic jams. I find the OB a very quiet car (no wind noise either), but not like the BMW, which is more like travelling in a vault, but a very agile one that would run circles around the OB. But the OB is quiet enough, rides well enough, handles well enough, and is comfortable enough that it's fine on trips. In other words, it's "good enough." If I had to get rid of one of the cars, I'd get rid of the BMW, solely because of the Eyesight. Unfortunately, I'd miss the sheer excellence of the BMW. By comparison, the OB is flimsy and cheaply constructed, even as it is a very good car. What the two cars do have in common is that they are both "engineers cars," which is something I like about about them. The BMW is three times the cost to purchase and about twice the cost to run. Incidentally, the BMW gets about the same gas mileage as the OB, but weighs 1,000 pounds more, and is *much* faster.

 

We just dumped a 2003 325 xi Touring to make way for the Outback we have yet to receive due to the recall.

The BMW handled fabulously and the steering was magnificent. It's handling was even better than my old V8 Audi S4 which I loved to death.

I just spent way too much time under the hood and way too much money on parts, and it was old enough I was nervous on highway trips. It will be fun to jump into something 13 years newer with a warranty.

 

Like so many others here I've loved all my BMWs and love the one now sharing the garage with my Outback.
But I'd never consider a BMW that didn't have a Boxer engine like my Subaru.

Or one that had more than two cylinders or two wheels.



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Like so many others here I've loved all my BMWs and love the one now sharing the garage with my Outback.
But I'd never consider a BMW that didn't have a Boxer engine like my Subaru.

Or one that had more than two cylinders or two wheels.


Nice bike
Jon Brush
ex /2 R50 and /5 R75 (for the boxer fans)

 

My dad has a 2013 5 Series. We've taken about a handful of trips to the South Carolina coast from Chicago both in his car and my 2011 Legacy. The BMW really felt like a bank vault, and was comfy for 2 people. Long distance comfort for 4 people definitely favored the Legacy. The 5 Series really doesn't have the passenger space to really be comfy for really long trips with that many people. The Legacy was still happy cruising at high speeds and wasn't that much louder. On our last trip to South Carolina with less than 30,000 miles, the BMW had a coil pack go bad. Even though everything was covered under warranty, it was still disappointing. On the plus side, BMW does not do Christmas lights with the check engine light.

 

BMWs are designed to be money machines for the dealer's service departments.

 

Mine needs to see the dealer about every 25'000 - 30'000 km, while the Subaru needs to be serviced every 15'000 and parts aren't cheaper.

 

BMW's can be wrenched on at home. There are plenty of electronic options out there.

 

yes....there are many things that one can do to a BMW without electronics.

-r

 

We were looking at the 2016 BMW X1 and used X3 when we were shopping. The only other contender was the Outback. I sure prefer the BMW design over the Outback's, but I was not willing to throw down 10K more for an equally equipped BMW, over the Outback.

We've had our 2.5i Limited since 2 months and we are very satisfied with it. Fuel economy is really good and it does not require premium gas.

With the 10K we saved, not buying the BMX X1, I was able to replace my 2010 Ford F150, getting a brand new 2016 RAM Ecodiesel.

Wife is happy with her new car, and I will be happy with my new truck! (when it arrives in a couple weeks).